Well done Microsoft, well done. You’ve listened to the fans, you’ve made some good policy changes and now Don Mattrick can finally sleep at night without waking to find burning Xs on his lawn. This is news that will make people happy. Unless they happen to be Cliff Bleszinski, it seems.
Asked for his opinion on the Xbox One reversing its DRM decisions, the former Gears of War producer said that “More studios WILL close and you’ll see more PC and mobile games,” via CVG. Targeting the great demon of gaming, used games sales, Bleszinski reckons that that secondhand market would be the end of us all in the next-generation.
More studios WILL close and you’ll see more PC and mobile games. “@JosephHamm: So what is going to happen to all these publishers now Cliff”
— Cliff Bleszinski (@therealcliffyb) June 19, 2013
Yep, once again it’s all the fault of consumers for daring to choose not to pay full price for a game on day one, as their very actions will DOOM the entire industry. “Brace yourselves,” Bleszinski said .
I have seen the number of unique gamer tags vs actual sales numbers and it ain’t pretty.
— Cliff Bleszinski (@therealcliffyb) June 19, 2013
At the end of the day many hardcore dislike what was attempted. You can’t do well in that space with many of your core unhappy.
— Cliff Bleszinski (@therealcliffyb) June 19, 2013
Especially when users have a choice. The nature of capitalism encourages competition and Sony played into that.
— Cliff Bleszinski (@therealcliffyb) June 19, 2013
Brace yourselves. More tacked on multiplayer and DLC are coming.
— Cliff Bleszinski (@therealcliffyb) June 19, 2013
You’re also about to see available microtransactions skyrocket. HATS FOR EVERYONE.
— Cliff Bleszinski (@therealcliffyb) June 19, 2013
I want *developers* who worked their asses off to see money on every copy of their game that is sold instead of Gamestop. Fuck me, right?
— Cliff Bleszinski (@therealcliffyb) June 19, 2013
As for who drove the change to Microsoft being forced to reconsider their policies, Blesznski reckoned that it wasn’t the gamers and their lengthy campaigns that had any effect. It was all Sony.
*Sony* forced Microsoft’s hand, not the internet whining.
— Cliff Bleszinski (@therealcliffyb) June 19, 2013
You’re going to see digital versions of your favorite games with added “features” and content to lure you to digital over disc based.
— Cliff Bleszinski (@therealcliffyb) June 19, 2013
“Do whatever it takes to keep that disc in that tray” is the mantra of developers in a disc based world.
— Cliff Bleszinski (@therealcliffyb) June 19, 2013
Urgh. I’m genuinely happy that the Xbox One is going to be a helluva lot more friendly towards gamers now. From what I’ve seen so far, it’s a truly fantastic console that was hamstrung by some poor decisions from Microsoft management, decisions that have now been killed off.
Of course, the only sticking point will now be the higher price tag, but if Microsoft can communicate why an improved Kinect sensor is worthwhile added cost, and the latest console war is going to be something to behold.
And it won’t be because of those damn consumers and their lack of cash for bloated game development projects.
Last Updated: June 20, 2013
John Ambitious
June 20, 2013 at 09:48
Oh Cliffy is now so bummed that everything he made such a big fuss about was all for nothing. Heaven forbit he should be proven wrong.
RitterBruder
June 20, 2013 at 09:51
sounds like a whack job in my opinion ! again filling his coffers is more important than the fans out there
Alex [SS] PsyChoPanthis
June 20, 2013 at 12:37
screw coffers… he has another Lambo to buy for his wife man….
ALKi1234
June 20, 2013 at 09:50
He’s feeling like a proper dumbass.
Trevor Davies
June 20, 2013 at 09:53
Probably not, that would take self-awareness.
John Ambitious
June 20, 2013 at 09:54
Oh snap
Admiral Chief Groot Wors
June 20, 2013 at 09:52
One thing I agree with is that the DEVELOPERS that do all the effing work get rewarded PROPERLY
Trevor Davies
June 20, 2013 at 10:02
Exactly. Maybe one day he’ll realise it’s publishers screwing the developers, not the customers.
Sir Rants-a-Lot Llew
June 20, 2013 at 09:54
Dear Cliffy
Without the second hand market most gamers wouldn’t even bother buying a console because they wouldn’t be able to afford new titles.
MS didn’t have to get rid of how they handle second hand sales. They just needed to get rid of the 24hour authentication DRM nonsense.
MS is acting like a spoiled brat who’s mommy just told him off for being a greedy bully and instead of sharing their toys they go and break them so no one can use them.
MS could have had a hybrid environment that allowed the reselling of games if you have internet and then allowing a transfer of a game if need be at a fee for the devs.
They are spiting the industry by taking it all away completely instead of coming up with a solution.
They are looking at the problem and not the solution.
RitterBruder
June 20, 2013 at 10:01
I agree with you ! it was the shitty on line thing that bothered me the most ! okey the second hand game thing isn’t a biggy for me seeing that I don’t actually buy second hand games. But the question is , if the developers have a problem with gamestop selling second hand games and they don’t get anything from the potjie, Why not go into contract with them personally , and Leave us the F^%&ck out of it !!
Sir Rants-a-Lot Llew
June 20, 2013 at 10:05
Precisely! There are ways and means!
MS could allow a 2nd hand market on their device where the profits go to the dev of game. That way people will use it. Not everyone no, but people who do have internet will and it will be a bonus for them! 2nd hand game still cheap and I know the dev is getting the money and I don’t need to go to BT games across town??? Awesome!
On the other hand you get the guy who has no internet then also going… Well, I can’t get this on the 2nd hand market but I surely can still get it at BT games across town cheaply and support my brick and mortar shop! Yay!
Both sides win.
Yes it’s over simplification but there’s a basic solution to the problem right there.
Or as you said. Get in to contract where you get a portion of 2nd hand sales from the brick and mortar shop. It’s not that difficult and I am sure there will be those only too happy to support devs to do so.
RitterBruder
June 20, 2013 at 10:16
I don’t know really how much one will pay for a blu-ray dics ! so another solution might be to sell the game cheaper, without over charging the customer might also be a option ! i might be seeing this the wrong way ! but I feel that some of the publishers are very greedy ! i know a lot of time and effort is spent in making these games ! but it feels to me that some of the prices doesn’t justify it and that’s why people resort to go the second hand route ! i might be wrong ! but that’s my opinion
Sir Rants-a-Lot Llew
June 20, 2013 at 10:20
It’s something that’s been proven over and over in business. Make something cheaper and you get an exponentially larger userbase which then drives profits up.
But even if they have to still sell at $60 and are worried most people will buy it second hand, why not get involved in the 2nd hand market. Create a system where people can trade their games and instead of paying the brick and mortar shop, pay the dev for the 2nd hand game.
Sure there are those that will still use shops such as gamestop (People mustn’t be forced to use the dev selling system) and it’s good because it keeps the shop profits up enough to stay open.
BUT you also now get the people out for convenience or who feel very strong about supporting the devs who would use the dev resell system.
It’s a win for both sides. The devs get a bit more sale value and the physical shops can still keep their doors open.
Daniel Keevy
June 20, 2013 at 09:54
It’s being disingenuous, to be honest. Yeah, the profit model is broken, but killing consumers won’t help the situation. Cliff is the face of game devs, but let’s not forget that a lot of the devs are responsible for a lot of these decisions.
Trevor Davies
June 20, 2013 at 09:56
Exactly what’s wrong with PC games Cliffy? Is it too hard to code for kb&m control? And you’re arguing against capitalism? Maybe you should stamp your feet & slam the door when you run out the room too.
John Ambitious
June 20, 2013 at 09:59
Trevor, great point dude. I was getting a bit excited when he said there will be more PC games. I really don’t see how that’s so terrible.
Martin du preez
June 20, 2013 at 09:59
Hey Cliffy:
STFU
Rather direct your attention to your Lambo and Bimbo wife.
stavey
June 20, 2013 at 13:03
Seriously, wtf on the wife attacks.
Happy Hamster
June 20, 2013 at 10:00
Idiot
Zubayr Bhyat
June 20, 2013 at 10:02
The solution is to drop prices for new games. $60 is ALOT of cash for most people. If console games sold at $30-$40 new there’d be much more new sales than used games. In addition, more quality games with better replayability would also help.
Lardus
June 20, 2013 at 10:07
Yup, the replayability of games are crucial. Who wants to keep a game forever if you are never going to play it again? If they make the games good enough that I want to keep it for future plays, then they wouldn’t have “such a big second hand problem”. Who is this Cliffy douche in any case? Gears of War? Played for 30 minutes on Xbox and put it down. Glad I could borrow it, else I would have paid $60 for 30 minutes! Not value for money I say.
jGLZA
June 20, 2013 at 10:21
Replayability? oh here is a tacked on MP and 6 months worth of pay DLC. 😀
HvR
June 20, 2013 at 10:44
Or keep disc games at $60 which you are free to trade and resell and drop digital copies to $45 which you can not trade/resell.
But as you said better quality games and replayability (and MP is not replayability) also stop ridiculous dev budgets of $100 000 000 (which go to management and PR); most of the time I enjoy fell thought out games with a fraction of the budget a whole lot more.
Zubayr Bhyat
June 20, 2013 at 14:17
That won’t be a bad thing if $45 is charged for a digital copy which I would want to keep. Another good example of a game I got second hand was Fallout 3, which led me to purchase New Vegas full price. Forza Motorsport 3 also led me onto the 4th iteration. Used games have a purpose. If there is a great old game available which I have not played (which there will be at any time) I’d like to try it and maybe adopt the sequels to come. How many times have you bought a second hand game and actually went out to buy the sequel when funds were provided?
Robert Infy Hart
June 20, 2013 at 10:03
He has a point about what to expect now. Instead of a finsihed product, they will now try their best to make as much money off micro-transactions, dlc and other licensed services that cannot be traded.
Trevor Davies
June 20, 2013 at 10:12
They’re doing that already. I understand why they’re doing it, and in the majority of cases I don’t really have a big problem with it. The market is changing & change can be painful. I just want value for money if I chose to purchase these add-ons.
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 10:46
Agreed. You said it. The market is changing. Tablets, cell phones etc. They need to adapt too. They need to stop wasting shit loads of money on purchasing the rights to songs like REM’s MAD WORLD, which Cliffy did for the first release of Gears, and though it was AWESOME level 9000, it cost a fucking small countries annual RDP, which we paid for.
Craig Deubler
June 20, 2013 at 10:03
Saffers should be really bummed about the reversal. It’s going to hurt you more than anyone else.
Publishers are going to focus on digital, and are going to push the price of disc based copies up. You’re going to be paying more / having to wait til all the cool kids have finished paying before you get a go.
Jakster
June 20, 2013 at 11:05
We already have Sony charging ludicrous prices for Platinum games.
Circuitflow
June 20, 2013 at 10:07
Cliffy can go fuck himself! DUMB FUCK!
Ryanza
June 20, 2013 at 10:07
I have sold all my Gears of War games over the years, except Gears of War 1, which is the best one.
Epic should just be focused on Unreal Tournament on the Pc instead of bitching about Gears of War DRM. You only managed to get me to keep and buy different versions, of ONE game in your series.
Side note, I still have Unreal Tournament on Xbox 360.
Umar Kiiroi Senk?
June 20, 2013 at 10:09
just feel horribly disgusted…Sony forced MS? … right ….. MS NEVER flinches to Sony, they know they F’d up badly and they know gamers hate them for it……sigh sigh sigh …… and what’s up with all those overused memes ….. bloody hell
Happy Hamster
June 20, 2013 at 10:10
Cliffy B
Jakster
June 20, 2013 at 10:51
Have you seen the insane profits that Bietie Games and Gamestop make on secondhand sales? In some cases, they refuse to bring in new stock just to push the secondhand sales. R500 for TLOU secondhand is not a pretty sight but it is opportunistic and someone is going to buy that game at that price. So that’s R500 + whatever the store made on the original sale. That’s more than the dev’s are making on the same copy.
HvR
June 20, 2013 at 11:00
Boogie (aka Francis) made a very good vid regarding this:
If you buy a 2nd hand copy from a retail store for 10% discount you are stupid and part of the problem.
2nd sales/trades between individuals are not hurting the industry or buying a new.
Also if the publishers do not like what the likes of Gamestop is doing, punish them not the consumer instead they are enabling them by giving them exclusive content and early releases. I mean WTF???
And most importantly if you make a PROPER product with more than 15 hours of game time you will not have a situation that there are heaps of 2nd hand copies at the retailers a month after release.
FoxOneZA - X-Therminator
June 20, 2013 at 11:19
Some good points there. Shops should be taxed off every used game sale. And like EA have stated, they will push more DLC. So I’m already expecting components to be missing from their games like Ultimate Team which is something I’ve never used.
HvR
June 20, 2013 at 11:24
They are taxed (income +VAT) and it shouldn’t be regulated.
The BIG industry should make a stand it is their fight with the retailers, Gamestop if you continue the 2nd hand practice we are not shipping you new release in the first month of release, no pre-release orders AND DEFNITLY NOT GAMESTOP EXCLUSIVES.
And is 2nd hand sales were so bad wouldn’t they have done it already?
Happy Hamster
June 20, 2013 at 11:01
i dont buy from BT anymore , Look and listen has pre order prices ect now as well and if its new its on the shelves
Warren Ross
June 20, 2013 at 10:17
Game studios come and go, but those developers move around and often go on to create newer and better stuff elsewhere. Looking Glass studios comes to mind.
The simple fact is that success should be built on the strength of the product and its popularity in the market, not through some sort of artificial tie-in that removes your options as a buyer (which is unsustainable). We also live in a world where a game built by a single developer (Minecraft) or for a mobile platform (Angry Birds) can outsell AAA titles that cost many millions to develop. It’s just part of how the video game industry continues to be shaped by the growth of technology (and the same thing happens with the movie industry).
I’d be very interested to see some hard numbers around second-hand game sales: IMO, the number of titles available second-hand are comparatively low. Only a handful of gamers actually bother to take their finished games in for trade, and prospective buyers can only choose from a few titles. I haven’t, for example, found a second-hand copy of Tomb Raider yet, so my only option is to buy new (at least for now).
In short, I believe the impact that the second-hand market has on new sales is pretty minimal, and that these kinds of alarmist views are just hot air coming from people who should be focused on developing the best games they can, rather than trying to foretell the future.
Trevor Davies
June 20, 2013 at 10:30
Well said. It’s also very telling when you hear a game sold 2/3 mil copies, but it doesn’t make a profit.
Todor Doutchevitch
June 20, 2013 at 10:19
I am sure there are better ways to combat the second hand market. How about not waiting for a full year of the game sitting on the shelves at full price, but rather drop the price by say, R100 every two months or so. I know I would rather buy an original copy, then a second hand one.
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 10:23
Oh Cliffy, shut the fuck up. Man, he drives about with cars worth more than my flat yet says the second hand industry has hurt him. What a tit.
Umar Kiiroi Senk?
June 20, 2013 at 10:25
he’s just trying to stay relevant in an age that could care less about him
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 10:26
Agreed. You should have seen his tweets back at people last night, fuck I was raging. I didn’t get a reply because I make 0000000′ less than him, but others were just plain told they are dumb dicks.
Umar Kiiroi Senk?
June 20, 2013 at 10:34
You didn’t get a reply because you don’t live in B-World … population Cliffy
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 10:36
I didn’t expect one back. Was just saying that all the people who said basically what I did didn’t get a reply. He just raged like some spoilt fat kid not allowed his 4th Double Down at KFC.
Umar Kiiroi Senk?
June 20, 2013 at 10:38
naa I know, just saying, hes too felf absorbed in his own little world, in his head he is a gaming god……..Damn you …. hmm double down
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 10:41
Dammit, now I want one too. I haven’t had a cardiac seizure this week, and I think I am in need of one. I’ll scream about Cliffy as I am lifted into the Ambulance…
Umar Kiiroi Senk?
June 20, 2013 at 10:52
Cardiac seizure from rage or the total cholesterol count of the double down?
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 10:55
Rage that I don’t have 2 sitting in front of me now! RAAAAGE!
Umar Kiiroi Senk?
June 20, 2013 at 10:58
Have you had it with the hot sauce?? god, I thought I was gonna die!!
RitterBruder
June 20, 2013 at 10:26
Duhhh ! of course it hurts his pocket !! cause now he can’t fill it every day to come and rub it in your face !! no you got it all wrong ! not just one tit !! but a f*&cking few of them !! chernobyled together to create one motha of a abomination !
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 10:27
YES! Read my rant above 😉
Jakster
June 20, 2013 at 11:30
He is a software engineer. They all earn that kinda cash. It’s their money and they can do what they like with it. Pretty cheap comment coming from you. You wouldn’t know just how much of studies they go through just to get that level. But let’s be cool here and Rinse our opinions to suite Sony.
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 11:32
You have absolutely no CLUE what I do, so how can you say ‘pretty cheap coming from you?’ I could be a god damn physicist for all you know.
Sageville
June 20, 2013 at 11:34
Mind readers fkkn everwhere!
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 11:38
Oi, developer scum! Who let you out! Lol! But yes, damn mind readers everywhere, just not in MS apparently trololo!
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 11:38
Oi, developer scum! Who let you out! Lol! But yes, damn mind readers everywhere, just not in MS apparently trololo!
Jakster
June 20, 2013 at 11:37
Clearly you don’t do much since you sit here all day and troll any Pro MS comments. Then you resort to swearing and anger. You could pretty much be anything but you know squat about what IT prof’s get paid.
Jakster
June 20, 2013 at 11:37
Clearly you don’t do much since you sit here all day and troll any Pro MS comments. Then you resort to swearing and anger. You could pretty much be anything but you know squat about what IT prof’s get paid.
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 11:39
Other than the fact my boet is in IT and is developing his own game (something I have mentioned many a time on this site) yeah, no clue TROLL. Now, be gone!
TiMsTeR1033
June 20, 2013 at 11:42
what is your boets game about? lol
TiMsTeR1033
June 20, 2013 at 11:42
what is your boets game about? lol
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 11:44
It’s called Silhouette and will be showcased at Rezzed You can check it out here developers blog. http://www.manikingames.com/blog/
TiMsTeR1033
June 20, 2013 at 12:01
Looks pretty cool. Hope its a success, will be interesting game by the looks of it.
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 12:12
Thanks man. Long way to go but these guys start earning big money quickly. I wasn’t earning R26,000 at 23. But hey, as arse hat above says, I know nothing about this ‘development’ stuff lol. So if someone who is 23 and living in SA is earning that a such a young age, and he’s only been out of uni for 6 months, can you imagine what Cliffy is bitching about? Yeah, perspective me thinks.
Jakster
June 20, 2013 at 13:00
Your so called “uni” education could have given your puny brain something more creative to say than arse hat? Your grammar is a fine example of a failed education system so I can expect that from you.
R26 000pm for 24/7 trolling????
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 13:03
HAHAHAHAHAHA!
Jakster
June 20, 2013 at 11:48
You are comparing an Indie self-funded developer to one that has been employed by Epic for decades. Your view of the industry is totally skewed.
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 11:39
Other than the fact my boet is in IT and is developing his own game (something I have mentioned many a time on this site) yeah, no clue TROLL. Now, be gone!
HvR
June 20, 2013 at 11:49
“They all earn that kinda cash” somebody forgot to send me my lambo, I could check my colleagues in the US but pretty sure nobody got their lambo as well.
The guy quite fairly made his cash from his idea (of which only the original was really good) which he developed through his own company that is how he got his cash.
The carbon copies (aka CoD copies) of his idea is no longer making the profits he wants so now he wants to blame someone instead of developing a new fresh on because he is to busy polishing the new pair of headlights he bought.
Umar Kiiroi Senk?
June 20, 2013 at 11:53
I develop software and I don’t earn all that much 🙁 , well not a F**k ton in anycase
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 10:26
And the worst thing is he blames that for the developers suffering? No, it’s developers spending totally ridiculous amounts on money on this that people don’t want that is killing the industry. It’s time for an industry shake up. I tweeted him last night and said that nearly every other industry has had to rework their business model, why not the developers? So frigging want to go all Hulk, pick up his Lamborghini, and smash it while screaming ‘second hand has hurt me, second hand has HURT ME CARS!
ElimiNathan
June 20, 2013 at 10:28
Are you a developer ?
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 10:31
No, just someone who follows industry norms. And he is not adapting to a new climate.
ElimiNathan
June 20, 2013 at 10:34
Sorry but then I rince your opinion
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 10:35
So one has to be a developer to know what is BS and what is not? I’m also not a politician but I can tell you we are being screwed over by our government mate. It’s simple logic.
ElimiNathan
June 20, 2013 at 10:46
Its not about what is BS, its about FACT. And you MATE are not a person im gona take “facts” about the industry from
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 10:47
Where are you getting your contrary facts from? And why the aggression, are YOU a developer?
Sageville
June 20, 2013 at 11:18
I’m a developer, hence everything I say is gospel.
I love it when people use terms like “MATE”, “CHIEF” or “BUDDY” when they mean the complete opposite, when I read “MATE”, I actually read “Fuck you” in a PC Mate-flavored wrapper.
Now upvote me already coz I’m a developer.
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 11:27
I use mate as I’m from England and that’s a term like boet to me… Upvote coming though, developer scum!
ElimiNathan
June 20, 2013 at 11:32
Haha Im a dev too, not a game dev though
ElimiNathan
June 20, 2013 at 10:52
Seeing as my previous comment was deleted I will just clarify, I don’t like it when ppl say something as if its fact when its actually just their opinion.
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 10:54
Who deleted it? LG do not delete comments, and I certainly cannot delete them. The industry is in trouble, that is a fact that Cliffy is going off about. He is blaming US, I will not put up with that as it is cowardice. He says we must change our ways to keep the money flowing in, he will not change his ways. You do not need an excel spreadsheet with facts to figure out who is in the wrong here. And I have no clue why you are taking this so personally, I certainly have not attacked you.
ElimiNathan
June 20, 2013 at 10:59
You responded to my comment that is no longer here. Anyway, I think what he is saying does make sense to some degree. If everyone was forced to pay each for their own game then the industry would probably be making allot more money. Who knows ?
HvR
June 20, 2013 at 11:08
Sorry for jumping in at the middle…
Not the industry and definitely not developers, only the publishers.
How many times have we seen the big guys buying up the small developers , just to fire the developers and creators to get their hands on the IP?
How many times have we seen big corps using small dev houses to develop the games just to fire them and screw them over before they could benefit from their hard work.
And finally if you make a good product there will not be heaps of 2nd hand copies for sales influencing primary sales. This is true in any industry yet it is only the gaming industry kicking up a fuss.
ElimiNathan
June 20, 2013 at 11:11
Dude 100%. Now that I can agree with
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 11:18
Not sure. I read a few things from devs who say that piracy is not as rampant as many have said, but those are few and far between. As to @1fa0e6b1f3f7cf51b52a09c424a3456b:disqus I totally agree. I think publishers put HUGE pressure on dvs, and that is what needs to change in this industry. When publishers burden a game like CoD with a 200-300% Marketing budget, you can see why people like Cliffy go off. That being said, I will stick to the fact that something has to change. Being blamed for issues in the industry when I have not once bought a pirated copy pisses me off, especially from someone loaded. He blames us, I blame the industry and its inability to change with the times.
Jakster
June 20, 2013 at 11:33
Your view of the industry is archaic. You seem to be stuck in the PS2 days with a blinkered console market. I recommended you get some anger management or have a one-on-one conversation with Kinect 2.0.
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 11:34
Foxhound, is that YOU! *tears well up
RitterBruder
June 20, 2013 at 10:28
F8&cking Hulk !!! got tears in my eye now !
Aussious
June 20, 2013 at 10:29
What happened to this guy? I mean really he used to be so in tuned with gamers and gaming,now just chills in the corner bitching about consumers and consumer trends killing game devs. Same consumers that bought Unreal and Gears and made him bucket loads of money.
Jim Lenoir (Banana Jim)
June 20, 2013 at 13:48
My money is on that dreaded human condition…. middle-age!
It could be the haemorrhoid cream that left him sour, or the fact that he’s rapidly loosing his hair. The guy has gone from the champion of gamers to just another old guy in a suit, scared of loosing his things, and shouting at the top of voice, at the kids on his front lawn.
Devon Stanton
June 20, 2013 at 11:09
I’m with Cliffy on this one I’m afraid he’s more right than consumers would like to believe… once you go behind the curtain and see the inner workings you might understand but as they say ‘ignorance is bliss’
HvR
June 20, 2013 at 11:18
What inner workings?
What makes the gaming industry so much different from any other industry in the world.
Better quality + better value for money = more sales
Devon Stanton
June 20, 2013 at 14:46
Seems so simple doesn’t it you’d be surprised. Does the same apply to your work place I wonder?
FoxOneZA - X-Therminator
June 20, 2013 at 11:23
We’ll have to wait and see. This could swing both ways. Obviously with his experience, Cliffy B knows more about the industry than us gamer.
Major Commodore 64 Darryn B
June 20, 2013 at 11:34
I think the gaming industry needs to take a look at how it does business. It’s become bloated. Take The Witch 2 as an example of how to do business. Made on a budget of between $8-$15 million, and the quality far surpassed titles like GTA IV and Gears of War, which cost far, far more to create.
Trevor Davies
June 20, 2013 at 12:09
Don’t come here with your fancy logic :/
Rinceyouropinion
June 20, 2013 at 12:26
Thank you. Agreed. It needs to take a long hard look at how it does things. As I have said many a time, every other industry has to look at how it does business if it wants to survive, why not gaming?
Jim Lenoir (Banana Jim)
June 20, 2013 at 14:03
Spot on Darryn!
Devon Stanton
June 20, 2013 at 14:40
I think a lot of industry has already recognised this, look at EA for example why do you think micro-transactions have been playing such a huge role in games? And look where it’s gotten them… My point is the industry is looking into it but there are no viable models at this point.
Major Commodore 64 Darryn B
June 20, 2013 at 15:31
And this is the same EA that proclaimed that games need to be cheaper, launched Origin and charged the exact same price for a digital game. If the industry wants to be like Steam, they need to put their big boy pants on, bite the bullet and just do it. No promises, no hype. Just implement and see how that works out.
Zubayr Bhyat
June 20, 2013 at 15:18
Metro: Last Light was another good example.
Zubayr Bhyat
June 20, 2013 at 14:10
Devon: How much to the devs make? How much must we pay per game? I don’t know about you but R600 for a new game is just far too much for someone like me who has major expenses like a home loan, child and car to pay for. If we all had disposable income to buy new releases every month then I’m with you every step of the way. That’s why used games are a boon.
Also, I said below that games need to offer more to justify the massive price tag. Fallout: New Vegas, Mass Effect, GTA IV and Forza Motorsport 4 (3 of which I bought at full price) offer healthy amounts of gameplay for what was paid for. Hell, Forza alone has kept me going since buying it two years ago. The question remains is where the real quality and varying experiences are. If every game I got gave me the experiences those games did then I’ll pay R600.
Leon de Bruin
June 20, 2013 at 14:27
I agree!
Devon Stanton
June 20, 2013 at 14:44
From what I understand Devs receive a regular salary just like the rest of us hard working souls, don’t be misguided by the big shots up in the glass offices there are thousands of hands that go into making each and every game we play looking at the credits is enough to justify that.
but it doesn’t stop there, Marketing, research, production, distribution, licensing all play massive factors to the budgets that get given.
Piracy and 2nd hand sales also have an impact on gaming budgets. Money doesn’t come from nowhere it has to come from a previous success also remember that studios work up to 3 years on a title, as a studio you need to pay these people to keep up their work.
Zubayr Bhyat
June 20, 2013 at 15:09
For sure, and I won’t disagree with you on Devs needing to earn their money. The fact that I’ve supported those very devs by buying new should tell you that this is very well remembered. The problem comes in when we have half-baked efforts such as Star Trek (movie-game tie-in) that are charged at the prices that the quality games are.
I also believe that second hand game sales have a place. Were it not for second hand games I wouldn’t have bought certain games new. One case was Fallout 3. When I went to CNA it was charged at full price despite being two years old. The value proposition of a second hand game is far better in this case. If game values were to depreciate over time in retail similarly to what second hand game values do then devs would still be making some money years on.
As for piracy I’ll agree with you. If you love a game, buy it and make sure the devs get the money for it.
Devon Stanton
June 20, 2013 at 15:21
Most licensed games don’t have a very long development cycle due to the assets and story under wraps with the movie studio, I’m with you on shoddy games though it burns me that they’re made. but this is where the consumers need to vote with their wallets and make the industry realise that this is not the quality we deserve.
Zubayr Bhyat
June 20, 2013 at 15:30
Oh believe me, we do vote with our wallets. 🙂 When you have limited resources you tend to be VERY picky where everything goes. I think we consumers realised we have a stronger voice than ever before, especially since this Xbox One debacle. The problem comes in when we have mob mentality not thinking things through, and as a result causing more damage than necessary.
CliffyB may still be right in the end, and we may even end up going completely digital with DRM in time, it’s just that the timing is not right. Instead of a smooth transition we were pushed into a corner and decided to bring out the claws 🙂
DrKiller
June 20, 2013 at 11:12
If the game prices was less than $20 (its announced to be $60), then the used games wouldn’t have made a difference at all!
fred
June 20, 2013 at 11:17
Most normal people have a limited budget for gaming asshole , and if games did not have a trade in value we would not buy it in the first place.(unless it was a third of the price)
Sageville
June 20, 2013 at 11:32
I think the gaming market has changed alot over the past few years, the old business model isn’t as profitable as it used to be and the consumers don’t want the nasty DRM options microslof have proposed.
The gaming industry will adjust and life will go on, if there is a development “Implosion” it will happen but there will still be the demand for games so games will still be made.
Somehow I think Cliffy confuses a business “Realignment” with some sort of game-pokolypse where dust gathers on consoles, cats and dogs living together, general mass hysteria. Yeah thats not gonna happen. The clever developers will simply adjust the monetization strategies and life will go on.
Trevor Davies
June 20, 2013 at 12:07
This just got me thinking, maybe GoW is just an analogy for the gaming industry. With the heroic CliffyB fighting for survival against the overwhelming onslaught of the Locust customer horde, who destroy everything in their path.
Jimmwyrm
June 20, 2013 at 11:41
I pose this question to you Mr Bleszinski… Say tomorrow, you decide that Lambo of yours, is not to your tastes anymore, I dunno maybe you tire of the colour. So you drive to your local supercar garage, and approach the dealer wanting to trade in your car, but alas, the dealer informs you, Lamborghini now no longer accepts trade-ins, or second hand sales, because don’tcha know, those used car sales are eating into their profit margin… I mean them engineers slave away on those cars for years, far longer than say a developer on a video game, and they develop all manner of technical patents and new tech just to help you not wrap the thing around a tree…
How annoyed would you be, that you now are stuck with that car, when you really wanted something new in bright pink, and even though you bought and paid for it, you are now not allowed to do with it what you wish…
But hey, you at least have buckets full of money lying around, so you can just go buy another, and eventually you will just have a huge garage full of dusty supercars because you can’t trade them or sell them second hand.
Jimmwyrm
June 20, 2013 at 11:41
I pose this question to you Mr Bleszinski… Say tomorrow, you decide that Lambo of yours, is not to your tastes anymore, I dunno maybe you tire of the colour. So you drive to your local supercar garage, and approach the dealer wanting to trade in your car, but alas, the dealer informs you, Lamborghini now no longer accepts trade-ins, or second hand sales, because don’tcha know, those used car sales are eating into their profit margin… I mean them engineers slave away on those cars for years, far longer than say a developer on a video game, and they develop all manner of technical patents and new tech just to help you not wrap the thing around a tree…
How annoyed would you be, that you now are stuck with that car, when you really wanted something new in bright pink, and even though you bought and paid for it, you are now not allowed to do with it what you wish…
But hey, you at least have buckets full of money lying around, so you can just go buy another, and eventually you will just have a huge garage full of dusty supercars because you can’t trade them or sell them second hand.
Enter Name Here
June 20, 2013 at 11:43
Same, poor guy is having a tantrum. 🙂 I find it ironic that he mentioned that we will see more PC games. Never mind the secondhand market, is it not the most pirated platform? So: Piracy good, selling a legal copy is bad.
JD
June 20, 2013 at 11:52
Cliff is fully entrenched the VG industry dogma, it is the lack of ability to see past the past that they are holding onto and will put most of them out of work.
You want people to not buy used, sell digital copies at prices that are matching what they are trying to sell used for. People are very willing to get up their sale rights for cheaper and more convenient games. That is why Steam works, but consoles especially Xbox have been terrible about this often selling digital copies 3+ months late and for far more then even a new disk copy sells for.
If people have a cheaper digital option it will drive down trade in values of disk games as well making it less tempting for gamers to trade in their games. So not only do you secure many gamers that can’t sell the game with digital but they also mitigate used disk sales.
The majority of the woes of the game industry have to do with their high prices, they try to be Abercrombie and they need to be Walmart. There are 10s of millions of gamers out there that should be buying those games and don’t.
Devon Stanton
June 20, 2013 at 15:30
so what happens when games are $20 but the market is not big enough to support the publishers and developers that made the game? take a game like Tomb Raider for example, the target for the publisher was 5million but only managed half of that amount, there’s a reason for this. those profits need to be injected back into the company to pay for everything that went into the previous game and to support it further, and hopefully a sequel.
Major Commodore 64 Darryn B
June 20, 2013 at 15:42
I still think it’s a sad day when selling over two million copies of a game is seen as a failure in this day and age.
JD
June 20, 2013 at 18:02
I started to write a large reaction/explanation but I’m rocking a serious migraine and I don’t think I could make it coherent enough to read. However they did sell 3.5 million in just a few weeks and likely have exceeded 5 million sold when the other tier buyers are counted.
Uberutang
June 20, 2013 at 12:06
More PC games! YES! Viva 180~!
OVG
June 20, 2013 at 12:51
I agree with him. It explaines why only 3% of today’s 140 million PS360s are buying games. Probably 10million end up playing the game after the 3million bought it new but the profits go to the second hand shop.
Jim Lenoir (Banana Jim)
June 20, 2013 at 13:56
But seriously, I don’t see why gamers (as consumers) should save an industry that is so inept at managing itself sustainably. You don’t see car owners being forced to bend over backwards for the car industry, or having to listen to rich drolle like Cliffy B ranting about how the userbase has just kept him from another lambo.
What makes game developers and publishers so entitled that they think our wallets need to be raped and pillaged by their longboats? If you want to remain profitable, do what other industries have done: restructure internally, fire the dead wood, change your products, make it so that more people want to buy them, and if you have to let the top brass take salary cuts… take salary cuts! Yes.. salary cuts, the textile industry did just that a couple years ago.
You can too, Game Industry! Now fuck off, you greedy pieces of shit, that includes you Cliffy B!
Double-O-Six and a half
June 20, 2013 at 14:14
Quote “I want *developers* who worked their asses off to see money on every copy of their game that is sold instead of Gamestop. Fuck me Right?” End Quote…
Well if developers stopped sitting on their lazy asses and developed games that actually worked on day one, without the need to patch them ad infinitum to “fix” what should never have been broken in the first place… then maybe, just maybe your consumers would buy more from you and less second hand when all the problems have been patched and resolved… (Yes I know I’m generalising and I’ll probably get letters…)
Until game developers in general start delivering quality products without the need for constant DLC and patching you’re going to get people hating on you… so cry me a river and get with what your users actually want instead of the bull you are intent on feeding them…
oh yeah, and as for your last suggestion in your quote above, I’d rather not, I have standards, maybe you’d like a banana instead!!!
CypherGate
June 20, 2013 at 16:32
Cliffy B is an ass. Simple.
CypherGate
June 20, 2013 at 16:39
Cliffy B better watch out though… any new game he makes now…. gamers might not buy simply because of his ass ways blaming us… the people who brings him his bread and butter and lambo…
iPrimal
June 20, 2013 at 20:19
Dude is pro developer. Who cares if the consumer gets stepped on?
I’m still uneasy about forfeiting my rights to the games I purchase to a company that has banned me before.
Mathias
June 21, 2013 at 12:04
Second hand gaming does hurt the industry, you know? I don’t agree with him, but can see where he’s coming from
Jump Ball Blog
July 2, 2013 at 21:56
if you think microsoft will not flip that switch right the fuck back on then you are in for it. Once they have their consumers back get ready for some back shot sessions.
Adam Durham
August 10, 2014 at 18:43
Um microtransactions have sky rocketed, sony was the one who forced the xbox one re-niggs, and studios are closing. Seems alot of what he has said was right….just sayin. Besides what a douche he may or may not be, he has helped create some amazing games and knows what he is talking about in the field….