So here is one of those stories that kind of make me laugh but get my blood boiling at the same time.
A law firm that specialises in consumer class actions has posted a form on it’s site that requests that users (read filthy pirates) that were banned from Xbox Live all get involved in a class action lawsuit against Microsoft.
The lawsuit is there for people who weren’t refunded for the remaining time left on their subscriptions. Are you freaking kidding me? What is your major malfunction?
The explanation given for this crap heap given on the site goes a little something like this:
As has been reported widely in the media, tens of thousands of Xbox owners have had their modified Xbox consoles banned from Microsoft’s online gaming service Xbox Live. Although modification of Xbox consoles is against the terms of use for Xbox/Xbox Live, Microsoft “conveniently” timed the Xbox console ban to occur just after the release of the new Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 game and less than two months after the release of the very popular Halo 3: ODST game. This “convenient” timing may have resulted in more Xbox Live subscription revenues for Microsoft than it would have generated had these Xbox console bans taken place at some time before the release of Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 and Halo 3: ODST. Additionally, sales of both Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 (published by Activision) and Halo 3: ODST (published by Microsoft Game Studios) would likely have been greatly diminished had the Xbox console ban occurred prior to the release of these games.
Oh cry me a friggin’ river.
If you pay money to get into a theme park for a day and then get caught stealing something, or vandalising property you ain’t going to be getting any of your money back. These people have breached the terms and conditions so they are out, end of story.
Seriously, this is pretty straightforward and anyone who thinks they might actually win this are just outright morons. You got your free games, now you got your punishment, deal with it loser.
Source: IncGamers
Last Updated: November 20, 2009
nazcanlines
November 20, 2009 at 08:58
preface:im not a pirate
now, why are you guys so obsessively anti-pirates, its like fundamentalism. Yes I understand they have the potential to destroy the industry in an extreme scenario etc. etc. but it also makes a great case for the over-inflated costs associated with gaming. As with every entertainment industry ( Music, Film etc.) The over-inflated end-product costs are associated with a bloated chain of development with too many costs at each level. The music industry is falling apart because of this, and is finding ways now to meet the customer on equal ground.
Same with the film industry, as recent runaway successes such as Paranormal Activity, THe Hangover, District 9 and others have shown, films now have to rely on different criteria than big names and huge budgets in order to turn a profit, and we are beginning to see the decline of the blockbuster.
So why is gaming any different.
Pirates across any medium are unethical, but this zealous hatred is approaching fanboyism in its move to declare unilateral and unflinching support for the developers no matter what.
And PS. as a kid growing up playing PC games, piracy was the only way for me to play as my parents werent gonna fork out time and time again for all those games which they couldnt understand or appreciate. And you know what, that piracy kept my gaming interest alive and is the reason i spend so much of my own legitimate money on gaming today as an adult. That is similiar to how people download music today illegally, but it gets them hooked into the music and gets them to go see live shows where the artists can make more money than they ever could off cd sales
atomic
November 20, 2009 at 09:11
I’m against pirates cause they are ruining gaming for the rest of us. Pirates are to blame to lack of decent LAN games these days, and viruses like STEAM and games for Windows live which totally ruin your gaming experience. Security measures will only increase further making it more of a schlepp to play games.
atomic
November 20, 2009 at 09:13
oh, and on the article.. How could sales be diminished if the pirates were banned before the release of the game? the pirates dont buy the F*cKing games anyways?
Bacon
November 20, 2009 at 10:57
because more people sign up to live in order to play online when big games like MW2 etc are released. Hence if there was a huge ban before hand, a lot of these pirates wouldn’t have taken the chance to sign up.
koldFU5iON
November 20, 2009 at 09:21
I used to work as a kid cleaning my dad’s care doing chores, and I used my pocket money to get my games, I guess really it’s Dependant on your background.
I think there has to be a strong “hatred” (if you must) against pirates, if not taken seriously then new people coming into gaming also think well if it’s not a “bad” thing then they’ll start doing it as well. a Blasé approach is not going to help in anyway.
The unflinching support comes into respect of the cost of games, direction, you can still support something but have an opinion on their pricing structure. and it has been mentioned countless times on Lazygamer with regards to price increases and “unfair” deals.
However that being said pricing is something that needs to be dealt with on a different level, personally I feel that the licensing of games MS and Playstation need to bring those down as that’s possibly the majority of the costs but then we don’t see what production costs are. and until we do maybe it’s best to be cautious to accusations of inflated and “bloated” costs, remember not all games make a profit and a lot of the money has to go to different people involved in the game you just have to watch the credits to see that.
WitWolfyZA
November 20, 2009 at 09:16
THATS IT IM GONNA SUE MCDONALDS FOR GIVING A BURGER 100 TIMES SMALLER THEN SHOWN ON THE ORDER BOARD!!!! Im Furious, Its such a rip off!! 😉
Milesh Bhana ZA
November 20, 2009 at 09:53
Morons should consider themselves lucky that their consoles weren’t bricked. MS have proved that an update can cause an RRoD, albeit intentionally. Wouldn’t it be funny if only the modded consoles all suddenly RRoD’d.
(Keep a nice list of the serial numbers so they can get laughed at when they try to get a swop out).
IloveBobbyKotick'sbusinessskillz
November 20, 2009 at 10:09
If they did that, it would be an even stronger case against MS. Personally, I wish they did, because MS would have been bled dry in the EU as well as in the US. :pirate:
al360
November 20, 2009 at 10:03
i fully 200% agree with “nazcanlines”
ster kinekor should be boycotted till they come to their senses to stop ripping the SA public off!!!!
i mean are we that dumb and so used to being ripped off
that its okay to alow it to go on
WitWolfyZA
November 20, 2009 at 10:16
Im not complaining i just use my Edgards club card and pay R25 a ticket, there the matter is solved
SH
November 20, 2009 at 11:51
What has Ster Kinekor got to do with anything?
IloveBobbyKotick'sbusinessskillz
November 20, 2009 at 10:06
lol the irony is, they have a case and a strong one at it, MS decided to wield the ban hammer, mere days before they released a major new release and more importantly the ban came without sufficient warning. Whether or not the pirates are wrong is immaterial, to the fact that a major corporation acted unfairly. (lol I love how US law works). :pirate:
WitWolfyZA
November 20, 2009 at 10:25
And plus MS has every right to ban these “modders” when they see fit. One person i knew had like 100 copied games with the “latest stealth” and they caught him. I felt remorse but knew he broke the law and broke the rules.
Just because people can copy games, doesn’t give them the right too.
These guys can be glad they got a slap on the wrist and got sent to sit in the corner, then go sit in jail
BobbyKotickhasMadskillz
November 20, 2009 at 10:32
It boils down to how legal EULAs are. They might not be as watertight as we’re let to believe. As I said, whether or not the pirates are wrong in modding is immaterial to whether MS acted inappropriately from a business stand point. There are after all laws protecting the consumer, and in this case, MS severly overstepped their mark. :pirate:
WitWolfyZA
November 20, 2009 at 10:37
I see where your coming from, makes one think.. Ooh darn maybe i should of read that code of conduct when i signed up. Who knows what other clauses and loop holes are hidden in that thing.
WitWolfyZA
November 20, 2009 at 11:11
There wont be a outcome, in my eyes if the court takes this in consideration. then any crook can get away with murder.
But its true what someone says, deep down inside we all at heart are pirates… if not in gaming then in the music,movie or heck even comic industry
ManicZA
November 20, 2009 at 11:11
“MS severly overstepped their mark”. lol, what are you talking about. It sounds like they just banned pirates as they have done before. We really are in no position to know what all the different factors were in MS deciding on the timing of the ban. There are lots of ways of looking at it, and ways to defend it.
for e.g. MS (or Infinity Ward) underestimated the number or pirates and didn’t factor them into the servers they would need for MW2, forcing them to ban at that time – it’s probably a procedural step used before buying more servers.
Or maybe they wanted to ban before Christmas, because they want to stimulate legitimate sales and rather warn other would-be-pirates not to mod their newly bought Xboxes over Christmas – this perspective would show that they are trying to protect pirates from paying subscriptions and then getting banned shortly after.
Whatever the case i’m sure MS has got the legal muscles to stamp this weak case out.
BobbyKotickhasMadskillz
November 20, 2009 at 10:38
I’m guessing MS will fight it and hope that the case never enters a court, or if it successfully lodged, try to settle it as quickly as possible (in other words, we won’t here about it again). There’s no need to take this to court and more importantly run the risk of testing the legality of their xbox live EULA. It’s something they’d rather try to avoid, because it could open up a new can of worms. :pirate:
bboy
November 20, 2009 at 10:36
An analogy:
You got drivers on the road who are not licensed and do not pay for their license, holiday season comes around and these people buy petrol put it in their cars and set off. At the same time, lets say, there is an increase of road blocks,because it makes sense since there will be more people on the road and a higher chance of catching them.
Should those drivers get a warning of where these road blocks are? Can they sue to get their money back for the petrol they spent? Of course not.
Whatever your stance is on piracy, I think the perfect time to make the ban is when it hurts most. :cwy: boo boo bee boo :cwy:
BobbyKoticklovesyourmoney
November 20, 2009 at 10:49
You’re committing a straw man fallacy bboy, and the reason I say this is because a road block has very little to do with your rights as a consumer, so your analogy isn’t really that analogous, but I appreciate where you’re coming from.
bboy
November 20, 2009 at 11:26
Perhaps a better analogy then would be someone who has paid their drivers license but is driving a stolen car, the car should get seized without warning, should they get a refund on their driver’s license? I think not.
You seem pretty pro-pirate so you’ll most likely pick this apart too rather than try and see this in the light of something we can all agree on.
Why don’t you provide an example in the defense of the pirates to help me understand.
BobbyKotickwouldsellhismother
November 23, 2009 at 09:05
That’s an ad hominem fallacy, whether I am or whether I’m not pro-pirate is immaterial.
For your information, I’m actually not pro-pirate, but I don’t agree with knee jerk responses to piracy. :whistle: The funniest one I’ve heard in recent years was that piracy promotes terrorism (fortunately the claim was utterly and thoroughly destroyed by an Australian journalist, but yet it’s still out there…).
Someone
November 20, 2009 at 11:01
So I guess everyone is a pirate. (ok majority of people)
If you take into account how “Sharing” is a part of what Piracy is then just lending a buddy your music CD or XBOX game is illegal.
Most people don’t even know that they are pirates.
Those people with MP3s on their phone as ring tones.
Kids who bluetooth songs at school.
The oaks who watch things like heroes or house on their PC.
Even ripping music to your PC without the copyprotection option on is illegal creating and ISO of a PC game is illegal.
Everyone hates pirates and theres an obvious reason for it.
Don’t go around poking people with pitch forks when your one as well.
I may be wrong in a few things I’ve said but, I guess you see my point.
Milesh Bhana ZA
November 20, 2009 at 11:41
I share stuff all the time. In fact, my friends and i make a point of not buying the same games so that we can just swop stuff when we’re done. That is perfectly legal.
But if you paid someone R1000 to mod your xbox so that you could then buy games for R100 instead of R600, the you can’t claim ignorance.
There is no ambiguity
Karl
November 20, 2009 at 11:04
That lawsuit except actually makes sense. MS knows people with modded consoles would go batshit for ODST and MW2, and possibly bought gold subscriptions en masse. How many people play MW2 online now? Its some ridiculous amount. So if they timed the banhammer a day or so after the release of MW2, and after the mass purchase of subscriptions, they stood to make a fortune.
Interesting lawsuit. If any of that is true in terms of the timing, its highly unethical behaviour by MS. Very interesting case, I look forward to hearing the outcome.
Milesh Bhana ZA
November 20, 2009 at 11:47
I’m sure that they did time the ban sweep around the big releases, intentionally hitting when it hurts most.
There is no doubt in my mind that it was intentional.
“its highly unethical behaviour by MS”
Can it be considered unethical?
There are far bigger fines that can be imposed on the offenders for piracy (the law actually says it’s like a few thousand dollars PER title), so if anything they got off pretty light by losing 1-12 months of subscription money.
Karl
November 20, 2009 at 11:06
and the fact that they just want their money back makes it more interesting.
As an aside, the constant published hatred towards pirates is really horrid. It pulls down the rest of the usually excellent content. And you missed a chance to examine the ethics of MS here. Just my 2c.
atomic
November 20, 2009 at 11:09
By warning pirates of the ban, MS would be condoning it.
“hey, filthy pirates, by the way, we are gonna ban your consoles on xyz date and time. please dont be connected to live because we want you to continue your filthy ways”
Pathetic! I say get the pirates details, file criminal or whatever charges, throw them in jail and let pirates find out what it’s like to get skrewed for a change. The harder the pirates fight, the more Brutal MS should be.
WitWolfyZA
November 20, 2009 at 11:26
MS already knew who all the pirates were, they just banned them at random thats all. I wouldnt be suprized if MS knew you had a pirated console the second you switched on thinking you can try your luck.
Remember these guys know their software, the “modders” bullshit everybody saying, ‘Hey we can let you play online and they wont catch u, what ya say?’
Just to find out you corrupted your profile,saved games and is R2500 out of a console after a ban.. now thats getting screwed… ROYALLY!
not to mention being black listed by MS in the future, i think after you get your new console …eventaully they’ll be monitoring you more closely then the average gamertag…
Kale
November 20, 2009 at 11:39
I think it’s a great idea! They should stick it to Microsoft. But on the flip side I think Microsoft have every right to the money owed to them for the games these pirates have copied and downloaded as well as the fines owed for the criminal activity.
I’m sure the R300/$30/17Pounds they will get be enough to start paying all the money back they stole…
So I say give them their money back and take every single one of them to court so they can pay for the games and the fines or go to jail.
V@mp
November 20, 2009 at 19:36
I totally agree with you. Give them their money back and
then sue their pants off for x amount per game and a nice little bonus for modding the console with intent to commit the crime as well 🙂
Uberutang
November 20, 2009 at 13:46
I might also be anti :pirate: if I got my games for free and had family and friends in the distros.
I really do not care. More people online = win.
Nick de Bruyne
November 20, 2009 at 13:57
Piracy is one thing, I’m just getting annoyed that these guys are trying to get something back. They knew they were taking a risk and they benefited from it for a long time, so they need to accept the outcome.
Nick de Bruyne
November 20, 2009 at 13:58
It reminds me of those criminals that break into a house and try to rape a woman, when the man hurts the criminal in defense the guy sues the family for assault and wins, taking their money as well. Piracy isn’t nearly as bad of course but it’s just not fair.
bunnyfight
November 20, 2009 at 17:42
yes cause raping and killing people is the same as downloading a game.
BobbyKotickwouldsellhismother
November 23, 2009 at 09:13
Totally bunnyfight.
And that’s the issue, equating digital piracy (or file sharing) to rape, assault and murder is just ridiculous. At best, it’s more akin to stealing from a retail shop, or pocketing an apple or two from Spar. Obviously, it’s still a crime, and when you’re caught you should either pay a fine, do community service, or if you’re a repeat offender either go into counselling or get a couple months worth of a suspended sentence but to insist that these guys be thrown into jail with the rapists, murderers etc. of the world is just utterly ridiculous. There are bigger fish to fry in this world, like whether or not Bobby Kotick is guilty of insider trading. :devil:
Nick de Bruyne
November 23, 2009 at 13:22
My very own words: “Piracy isn’t nearly as bad of course but it’s just not fair.” – I said it myself…
Uberutang
November 20, 2009 at 14:15
Yeah for sure. It is like speeding. You get caught, you pay up.
Suing the dude coz he caught you is retarded.
WitWolfyZA
November 21, 2009 at 09:04
Im actually surprised the pirates actually decided to go through with this. Just when did criminals get rights?
BobbyKotickwouldsellhismother
November 23, 2009 at 09:19
You’re innocent until proven guilty, and the vast majority of those who were banned from xbox live never had the opportunity to have their guilt tested. Are you 100% certain that all of them modded their consoles to play pirated games? We’re assuming that they did, and you know what they say about assumptions, (i.e. being the mother of all F-ups). There’s always reasonable doubt, and if that exists the case for unilateral banning is anti-consumer and therefore utterly and completely illegal, therefore the case against MS is actually strong, and they are well in their rights to demand their money back.
As fellow consumers, you should actually hope that they win. :kissing:
ewie
November 23, 2009 at 09:33
They only ban the ones where they could detect a
non bought copy of the game was played.
Have a look at xbox-scene.com and you will understand.
StrifeHawkins
November 23, 2009 at 14:14
Seriously stop acting holier than though half of you people are or were heavy pirates so stop lying!
What if you bought a 2nd hand xbox and you did not know it was chipped? This move is anti consumer, and pirating is wrong bla bla bla but its pirates that have forced companies to adapt, and not try and rip the consumer off, these days i dont think piracy is such a huge factor these days, surely must be on the decline with all these teeny boopers who think their holier than thou
Ndibu
November 24, 2009 at 01:15
Bobby, getting serious pirate vibe from you. No analogies, simple facts: Xbox Live terms and conditions do state that they have the right to refuse service to modded console. Pure and simple. You mod your console(even if its not for pirating) you get banned from Live. You don’t like it? Do not agree with the terms and conditions then.
As for Live subscription, the gamer’s account has NOT been banned, just the console. The user can still access and play on Live, provided it is on a console that does not go against the T&C’s.
Short of it? MS does not owe them jack.
Bobby Kotick only plays golf
November 24, 2009 at 16:34
No, I’m not a pirate, but I do have strong opinions on your rights as a consumer and not being taken advantage of by big business.
“Jissus, passop die rooi gevaar”
The fact that they only banned the consoles and not the user tags (and it happened prior to yet another major games launch) should highlight the fact that the motivation behind the bans has nothing to do with curbing piracy but has a lot more to do with increasing profits on hardware sales.