Home Gaming Flamebait Friday Debate – Was God of War 3 Too Short?

Flamebait Friday Debate – Was God of War 3 Too Short?

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[Update: As has been pointed out the headline didn’t make sense and that is entirely my (Gavin) fault, the original headline was asking whether Uncharted 2 was to long which then changed to God of War 3 being to short and I felt Uncharted 2 was a better headline… but left the too short part. Idiot…  So it’s back to God of War 3. The article should make more sense now]

The topic of game length has been popping up a lot lately, and it’s about time that we sorted this out once and for all. So let’s get our debate hats on.

People always consider a 5-6 hour game to be too short, with the general unspoken rule being that a games campaign should at least be somewhere around the 10-12 hour mark. Times are changing though, and game campaigns are getting shorter and shorter. At the same time, we still have releases like Fallout: New Vegas and Red Dead Redemption offering hours and hours of game time, at the expense of a lot of traveling / fillers / mini-games and so on.

People still tend to see 60 hours of aimless wandering as way more value than 6 hours of direct, focused gameplay and storytelling. We are forking out a LOT of money for games these days…

So speak up, let’s hear it.

Last Updated: November 5, 2010


  1. You’re definately baiting me here Nick. You know how disgusted I was with how short Kane & Lynch 2 was. *spit*


  2. Cleric

    November 5, 2010 at 10:49

    Calling Uncharted 2 too short is tantamount to blasphemy in my books. I loved every moment of the campaign. It was tight, focused, funny, and most importantly, FUN. It didn’t overstay it’s welcome (seriously, how many more one-liners could we have handled?) and while many may complain about the ending, it just gave me a good reason to restart the game and play through on Crushing to enjoy it all over again.

    And any feeling of being short changed will instantly disappear once you get into the games FANTASTIC multiplayer. The co-op is rad, the horde mode is fun, and the regular MP honestly feels better to me than gears of war (which I’ve probably clocked over 60 hours of on Live).

    That answer your question?


  3. Ricky

    November 5, 2010 at 10:49

    Quality of quantity…


  4. RSA-Ace

    November 5, 2010 at 10:50

    I think Halo Reach would’ve suited the title better. Having finished it recently I was really disappointed that it was so short. Uncharted 2 on the other hand didn’t feel short at all. Wasn’t it around 10 hours?


  5. Uberutang

    November 5, 2010 at 10:59

    Also sure uncharted took me around 9 or 10 hours to complete.

    UC2 and GOW3 where not 20 hour games, but they felt complete. Not rushed, not to short etc.

    MOH felt short. Reach felt short. MW2 felt like a demo.


  6. Fox1

    November 5, 2010 at 11:00

    Short games are not worth it of you are into SP gaming.


  7. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 11:01

    This week I reviewed both Star Wars: The Force Unleashed 2 and Vanquish. Both games were only in the 5 – 6 hour range on normal difficulty and I found it amazing to see how different those hours can feel depending on the content.

    I had fun in Star Wars, but it felt like it just ended. Vanquish on the other hand blasted you in the face for 6 straight hours, and by the end of it, it felt like a crazy rollercoaster coaster ride and well worth it.


  8. D4RKL1NG

    November 5, 2010 at 11:03

    Uncharted was short bursts of awesome! And I enjoyed every second of it. It was like a 10 hour summer blockbuster movie! :wub:


  9. ruslan74

    November 5, 2010 at 11:10

    Games can be short for all I care as long as they offer a decent story or relentless action. There is a limit one can sit on a rollercoaster so why lengthen it? 😉

    MoH was a much better SP experience than MW2, Vanquish is even shorter than that if you rush through on Casual and dont take interest in replaying the game but its a great experience.


  10. Gavin Mannion

    November 5, 2010 at 11:11

    Sorry I messed the headline up while editing… hopefully it makes more sense now.

    As for my opinion, I thought MW2 and Halo Reach were the perfect length. I love the 6 hour games because I get to actually finish them now.


  11. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 11:12

    I actually finished Uncharted 2 in one sitting on a weekend :blink:

    Needless to say, it was quite the experience cramming that much awesome into one play session lol. Awesome :wub:


  12. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 11:16

    I have to also add that I see a lot of people play a game on casual or very easy difficulty and then complain that a game is too short, Vanquish would be a great example of this but it works for so many games.

    If you are playing on Casual even though you have been gaming for years, you obviously don’t want a big challenge and just want to experience the games story and campaign. Without any deaths, challenge or need for major strategy you can just waltz your way through the whole game with little to no worry.

    So not only is the game a lot shorter, but I think that for many games it actually destroys the gameplay that was intended. Some games want you to think about your approach, and not have you just walk in and kill everything on your first try.


  13. Syth

    November 5, 2010 at 11:21

    Without a doubt certain games are too short. The yearly installments of games or releasing various games from the same franchise (COD!!) in relative short succession (a year is short according to myself) is to blame. The games are highly polished and give great satisfaction but only for a few hours.

    People keep on buying these games because that short period of time is an awesome experience, but overall value is not good.

    The multiplayer aspect is something totally different I get it, and i’m not going into the longevity thereof, I’m soley speaking in terms of singleplayer.

    On the other hand, there is nothing worse that a game dragging on and on and on. It’s a fine line, but R 600 for 5 hours, damn that a bit too much.


  14. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 11:30

    You know when I really think about it… pretty much any game that I have played that was longer than around 12 hours actually took effort from me to finish in the end.

    Its nice to think that I am getting more value, but in the end I am sitting with quite a lot of games that I only completed 75% of and feel like its some sort of chore to go back and complete it.


  15. mark

    November 5, 2010 at 11:36

    well i think some game are def way to short 10 hours should be the benchmark for sp and sp games still are the main sellers mp games are fun but i personally am loving fallout new vegas with over 35hr in not even touched the main story yet (even the glitches are liveable but not excusable) cant wait for GT5 im sure it will be longer than 10hrs lol


  16. Cleric

    November 5, 2010 at 11:46

    Was GOW3 too short? No. Was the ending rubbish? Yes. Could it have been a much better game? Yes


  17. AC!D

    November 5, 2010 at 11:52

    GOW 3 took me 9 hours according to the end game clock. Uncharted 2 took close to 12 hours for me….granted maybe a couple of those hours were spent drooling at how beautiful everything was :biggrin: Also the game has a massive multiplayer half to it thats fantastic and some crazy co-op which it sounds like most of you have not tried :whistle:

    This debate shouldnt really be about those two games though and i know why Nick chose them and why they are specifically playstation games afterall this is the Flamebait thread but in the end i think we are missing out on talking about the games that really should be taken to task like every single FPS game bar one or two like Half Life and the recent releases of Vanquish and Star Wars.

    My rule is that if its not a game from a TOP 10 developer of mine and the single player campaign is under 8 hours then its a rental or bargain bin special for me like it will be with Star Wars. I love Mikami though and i know all 6 hours of Vanquish will be incredible so he is one of the very few that gets a pass this time around.

    As for FPS games i get the multiplayer argument believe me but dont you guys think it would be better if we split the FPS up. For example Halo can go the route of MAG where they create this massive multiplayer experience and upgrade it wqith massive expansions similar to what MMO’s do. The we can get a ssingle player campaign for Halo in the proper 10 – 12 hour markr and the devs dont have to focus 60% of their resources on multiplayer modes. What do you guys think of that idea?


  18. Syth

    November 5, 2010 at 12:03

    GOW was awesome, did almost everything perfect, including the ending :ninja:


  19. Bobby Kotick for Dummies

    November 5, 2010 at 12:03

    Are we debating game lengths again? I will agree that quality should trump quantity, especially when a game is being unnecessarily padded with frivolous nonsense to stretch it out, however I believe strongly that there has been a worrying trend where game lengths have plummeted without game prices decreasing. It was already worrying when campaign modes dropped from a healthy 15 hours to 8 hours (during the 90s and early 00s), and now we find ourself discussing game lengths of sub-6 hours. What’s next? A Call of Duty game that has a campaign mode of 2 hours? You think it’s impossible? I thought the same about games with average lengths of 6 hours.

    Obviously different games from different genres have very different narration styles and gameplay styles. FPS games tend to be shorter, because they’re generally limited on the story side, and owing to their gameplay mechanics, you have to keep it short. 3rd person action titles tend to be in a similar boat as FPS titles, but you can actually add more story elements to these games. (A benchmark length for a FPS SP should be between 8 to 10 hours and the benchmark length for an action title should be 10 – 15 hours)

    RPG games are my favourite genre because they generally allow for the most creative stories, character development and potential for world exploration. In terms of length anything below 30 – 40 hours (for RPG games would be a waste).

    I have to say though, that I can’t identify with gamers who only want to play a game for under 6 hours (especially on the easiest setting). That lack of commitment to a game is alien to me*. I have probably clocked more than a 100 hours in each of Oblivion, GTA SA, GTA4 etc. With Red Dead Redemption sitting at a healthy 65 hours.

    From a value for money perspective, I think sandbox action games and RPGs offer the most value for money (as do MP enabled FPS). Games with only a SP mode and sub-6 hour gaming are setting a bad precedent and regardless of how amazing they are during those few hours, at R600 a pop, they’re dangerous to gaming in general.

    *I do understand where Nick is coming from, especially since he’s reviewing a new game or three almost on a weekly basis. I’ve been there, and you do feel very overwhelmed very quickly, especially with a deadline looming and your write-up hinges on completing a game. However, he is finding himself in a situation that’s atypical to most gamers. The vast majority of us do not get 2 or 3 new games a week, and for the most part, we pick 2 or 3 games a month to keep us entertained, therefore game length, replayability etc. are crucial.


  20. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 12:03

    I’ve heard that idea being tossed around often recenty, and it definitely will be interesting to see if anyone actually starts splitting the games into SP and MP.

    There are some games that I couldn’t care about the multiplayer because it doesnt appeal to me, and then other games like Bad Company 2 where I barely even touched the single player and only play the multiplayer.

    So in that sense, I am keen for the idea. However the way that they would spin it would probably end up costing more than a normal priced game if you wanted to buy both “sides”.


  21. Cleric

    November 5, 2010 at 12:06

    Wow, so someone out there liked the ending? Glad to hear it. Maybe it’s just myself and my close friends then, as I found the ending disaterously bad (everything after the 2D Zeus fight, that is).


  22. Parker

    November 5, 2010 at 12:09

    Funny, when games like Vanquish are 6 hours long, it isn’t worth the money. Call of Duty? Nah, it has multiplayer.

    But Vanquish’s single-player campaign > Call of Duty’s

    And I’ll probably replay it over and over and over…

    As for the quiestion… God of War 3 was longer than 1 and 2, so I don’t know where these complaints come from. The ending was undoubtedly shit however, almost undid the hours of awesome that preceded it.


  23. Bobby Kotick for Dummies

    November 5, 2010 at 12:11

    Amen! MOH’s SP mode is definitely an improvement over MW2 which was just poor.shit.poor, but it really needed more. If MOH added two or three more chapters (another 2 hours), it would been a plus.


  24. Bobby Kotick for Dummies

    November 5, 2010 at 12:11

    Definitely, and definitely not for R600 a pop.


  25. Generic ZA

    November 5, 2010 at 12:17

    GOW3, isn’t that only due in September 2011 ? Just asking.


  26. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 12:18

    Don’t get me wrong Bobby, when I review games then the length doesn’t apply to me, I am mostly drawing for personal gaming time here, as I still have so many games to go back and finish. Reviewing games is easy because you know you have to get through the game, so you make time for it and make sure it happens. It’s the other ones that kill me.

    I would say that my personal preference for a single player campaign (that isn’t sandbox or RPG) is around 10 – 12 hours, as long as the content is worth hanging around for.

    I agree with you so much on the RPG and Sandbox genre though… whenever a new friend of mine tells me that they are going to buy a PS3 or Xbox 360 soon and only one game for the first while, I will always recommend something like Red Dead Redemption or GTA IV. Specifically because not only do they have hours and hours of play time for someone who only has one game, but has multiplayer modes as well. Amazing value for money.


  27. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 12:23

    You know, it freaked me out the other day when I realised that in the time it takes to finish the new Castlevania: Lords of Shadow, you could pretty much finish God of War 1, 2 and 3.


  28. Bobby Kotick for Dummies

    November 5, 2010 at 12:25

    God of War 3 not Gears of War 3


  29. NiteFenix

    November 5, 2010 at 12:27

    That’s a good game then right there!


  30. Bobby Kotick for Dummies

    November 5, 2010 at 12:27

    It boils down to what do you do after you’ve finished the game? Even though COD MW2 has the worst pile of crap for an SP ever created, you can still get months out of the game, by grinding for levels and unlocks online.

    As for Vanquish? What do you do with it after you’re done with it? Replay it? Once? And then what? Trade it in for another game, or store it in your collection?


  31. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 12:29

    I actually wanted to mention that. I realised after chatting to folk that some people basically slam through the campaign mode and then trade the game out straight away.

    If the guys are getting half the price for the trade in, then they are paying around R300 for a single player experience, which is why I think a lot of them don’t mind.


  32. Generic ZA

    November 5, 2010 at 12:48

    Ah Thanks, that makes sense, these damn acronyms 😀


  33. Lefornicator

    November 5, 2010 at 15:30

    @ Nick

    What difficulty did you play Uncharted 2 on? Easy?


  34. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 15:41

    No I played on Normal, took me around 12 hours


  35. Luna

    November 5, 2010 at 16:12

    I don’t like games being too long. I don’t have enough time in life to play a bunch more 50 hour games. I have yet to play God of War 3, or Uncharted 2, as I had planned to borrow them from my friend downstairs. I finally don’t have a lot currently being played, so I think it’s time to bring one of those back up with me tonight.

    Online multiplayer does not a game make, for me. I played through Halo Reach with friends, and loved it. Then I moved onto playing competitive multiplayer, and I started to get pretty good. Then one night, 6pm rolled around and suddenly every jackass that plays Reach comes on, starts TKing (Team killing for those not in the know), and overall ruining the game. It got so bad that I refuse to play multiplayer in a FPS ever again. They totally destroyed any fun the game was. NO ONE cooperated to achieve the goal of the mode we were playing at the time, and it was a miserable experience. Multiplayer should never count to the total good of a game


  36. AC!D

    November 5, 2010 at 16:20

    When you think about the console attach rate….What was it 8 games for every Xbox sold then you realize though that not everyone is as fortunate as us to play 20 games a year so those 4 – 6 hour games end up screwing over a lot of ppl who cant afford tons of games.


  37. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 16:34

    @AC!D Regarding Attach Rates

    I get what you are saying, but you need to also remember that a lot of those people only buying around 8 games on their consoles aren’t massive gamers like us, and so only really sit down to play games every now and then.


  38. Cloud Strife

    November 5, 2010 at 16:46

    God of War 3 is a masterpiece, not too long and not too short, challenges offered in the game are a big plus and adds an hour more to the game play,plus if you play god of war ghost of sparta you get deimos skin, which is pretty cool.


  39. Aussious

    November 5, 2010 at 17:04

    Well God of War 3, felt just right finished it in more or less the same time as the first 2. MGS4 on the other hand is perhaps the most drawn out game I have ever played no actually not played watched! Majority of the cut scene could have been reduced by two thirds to make way for actual gameplay. Its just isnt the way I remember it when i played Kojima’s original masterpiece. Games such as Mass Effect, Bioshock,GTAIV and Infamous are shining examples of well paced games unlike their Japanese counter parts which either feel too drawn out or too short.


  40. Cloud Strife

    November 5, 2010 at 17:17

    MGS4 was the end of the series for David a.k.a Solid Snake and it was long because they had to wrap up all the plot holes from MGS2.


  41. AC!D

    November 5, 2010 at 17:24

    Personally i would not call GTA a well paced game. You spend half the 30 hours driving to activate a mission and driving from activation to the mission. Thank God the recently decided to add checkpoints to the series because before that it was even more frustrating and they always make the mission start point on the opposite end of the map to where the mission activation point was.

    MGS4 needed to be drawn out to tie off loose ends. It saddens me that ppl couldnt understand that. Its not easy to tie off a storyline that spans 7 games into one game without long cutscenes.


  42. Cloud Strife

    November 5, 2010 at 17:30

    I feel GTAIV is a well paced game, as you can progress with the story at your own pace, the game only becomes a chore if you die alot.


  43. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 17:53

    I felt that The Lost and Damned and The Ballad of Gay Tony were both really well paced compared to the main GTA IV game, and it felt a lot more fun and better in my opinion.

    Granted, if you wanna mess around and go look for stuff, then you can if you like, which is nice.


  44. Aussious

    November 5, 2010 at 17:55

    True by no means am I saying its a bad game but my point is the east hasnt kept up with times I’mean if you take the best eastern frachises and compare them to their western counterparts the east is trailing with each installment. Example Resident Evil 5 vs DeadSpace, GOW3 vs Bayonetta, FFXIII vs Mass Effect 2, MGS4 vs Conviction, Silent Hill vs Alan Wake its shocking how dated Japanese games are when compared on all levels with their western counterparts. I personally use to choose the MGS series over Splinter Cell, but I must say Conviction felt like a vastly superior experience when compared to MGS4, its evolved completly from its origins ubi soft took a gamble and changed the gameplay mechanics yeah it pissed off some purists but the game feels grown up. Whereas MGS4 is almost unchanged gameplay wise the cutscenes are like 5x longer than the original, story has really become utter nonsese and the dialogue just plain corny at times. I still recon the best MGS game was Twin Snakes its a pitty most have never played it.


  45. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 18:27

    We are definitely in a strange place in gaming at the moment, where even Japan is saying that they think that they are falling behind. They still reign supreme in some areas, but others are failing to make progress.


  46. Cloud Strife

    November 5, 2010 at 18:44

    its the lack of diversity in the industry, in most top class studios like epic and naughty dog, you get a myriad of different people from different walks of life, japan does not have this advantage and i might be wrong but i don’t think they integrate well with other developers from other cultures, they usually have the whole studio develop it and give advice, but they dont ‘actively’ work together with people of different cultures. That is why you mostly see half naked schoolgirls trying to save the world all the time, they need new blood.
    Just an opinion :cheerful:


  47. AC!D

    November 5, 2010 at 19:46

    Oh man i really hate this Japan is falling behind nonsense. Sorry but here comes a mamoth post from me about why you guys ( Nick, Ass and Cloud ) are all dead wrong.

    Firstly let me start with your list Aussious:

    – Is Resident Evil 5 worse than Dead Space in my opinion yes. Here are the reasons: Capcom decided to let Shinji Mikami the creator or resident Evil go and decided to let some tool Americanize Resident Evil. So what do they do? They go and add co-op which entirely defeats the purpose of a survival horror. Was it a great co-op action shooter? Sure. Was it Resident Evil? Hell no! Is Dead Space better than Resident Evil 4? Hell to the NO!!!

    – GOW 3 and Bayonetta are trying to do two different things and i cant fathom why ppl cant see this. Bayonetta is a fantastic game and has a meta average in the 90% AAA arena so i dont get where you find it to be falling behind western games. GOW tries to be accessible with an easy to use combat system and focuses more on your experience in the game i.e story, level design and Epic scale while Bayonetta has a combat system better than any game in its genre including GOW. Its apples and oranges for me. Both are fantastic games and sure you dont have to like Bayonetta but dont call it a game thats fallen behind the times.

    – FFXIII VS Mass Effect: Well again i agree Mass Effect is miles better but they are completely different genres. To call mass effect an RPG is being generous. Mass Effect 2 is more like an action shooter with minor RPG elements. Also just because FFXIII was a flop you cant just ignore the brilliant Demon’s Souls and Valkyria Chronicles which both earned AAA status amongst the media! JRPG’s and WRPG’s can co-exist and im glad for both kinds in my life!

    – I dont even want to dignify you with an answer on this because if you believe Splinter Cell conviction is better than MGS4 you are not well my friend. Even Peace Walker a PSP game got better reviews than Conviction which had a little 5 hour campaign. Ask anyone to list you there to 20 games and MGS will always be near the top or on top and Splinter Cell would be lucky to make a top 50 games list. Wow i cant believe you just went there!!!!

    – Is Silent Hill getting stale? Sure. Let me know though if Alan Wake makes it to sequel number 8. Its easy to compare something tried against something freesh and new and by the way again you are comparing a survival horror to a thriller which makes no sense.

    Ok so dont believ me that Japan is doing fine? Lets test that theory by genre:

    – Stealth Genre leading game sales: MGS and Assassins Creed. TIE!

    – Racing Genre: Leading sales: Mario Kart and Gran Turismo. Japan own car games.

    – Survival horror: Resident Evil series. Again another point for Japan.

    – FPS genre : The west wins this one hands down.

    – RPG’s: Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest and Zelda whip Mass Effect and Fallout’s buts.

    – Platformer: Mario is laughing at you!

    – Fighter genre: Street fighter, Super Smash Bros brawl, Soul Calibre and tekken say hello!

    – Hack and slash genre: Kratos owns this one followed very closely by Dante which wont last for long after Ninja Theory ruin the series. Why because Capcom wants to tailor to western tastes. What a Joke.

    – Action adventure = Naughty Dog + Team Ico. Nuff said!!!

    – Open word genre: Rockstar own this one forever!!!

    Ill stop there but in conclusion when you take one small country with a couple of million ppl and a couple of thousand developers and compare them to the rest of the word i.e fuck loads more money and developers all over the world then suddenly Japan doesnt seem to be doing too bad do they?????

    Myabe their tech and development money is falling short but innovation and incredible games! Hell to the no and games like Ni No Kuni, Zelda, The Last Guardian, The Last Story, GT5 and many more coming soon are proof of this!!!!


  48. Cloud Strife

    November 5, 2010 at 19:58

    @ACID Very compelling argument, But remember alot of those games were established over a decade ago, And the new ips, are not pushing the industry as heavily as western devs, back in the day.

    -Bayonetta Uses God of War Style System
    -Vanquish have not played much but it seems like a quicker Gears of War
    -FF13 Very Linear
    -FF14 Poor Quality
    -Quantum theory, Borrows Heavily from Gears
    -Tales of Vesperia Old mechanics
    -Last Remnant Poor Quality
    -Star Ocean not genre defining
    -Infinite Undiscovery not genre defining
    -Lost Odyssey uses old mechanics

    So ACID i agree the Japanese industry is far from dead, but i think it needs to rethink their new ip, and start creating new cultural gaming icons


  49. Nick de Bruyne

    November 5, 2010 at 20:19

    @AC!D – I didn’t say it was dead, I said that even they are saying that they are behind. Here:



    I think what is more important is that the Western market has become so big, and they need to be able to cater to that market to survive in this day and age. Its not about whose games are better, its about who’s games sell. Sure, you would like it to be both and Im sure they would too, but it has to sell.

    Thing is… a ton of Western gamers that are relatively new to gaming are now living in a world of Halos, Modern Warfares and Grand Theft Autos. They don’t care for JRPGs or insane Games like Bayonetta that have ridiculous cutscenes and characters. They go with what they know, which is why they click so much with western devs and the japanese click so well with their devs.

    If anything it comes down to cultural understanding – and if you don’t understand your audience, then you cannot cater to them on a grand scale.


  50. AC!D

    November 5, 2010 at 20:52

    @Cloud Strife: Japanese devs are being bullied by their publishers into creating games that will cater to western tastes. How then can these Japanese developers innovate when they are forced to give us co-op, Unreal engine, characters on steroids and guns in every game?


  51. Cloud Strife

    November 5, 2010 at 21:04

    i agree, japanese devs are in a tricky situation, the japan market is shrinking,and other markets growing, can this trend be reversed?

    what i personally think is that the reason why japanese devs have less games is because of the psp, have you seen the amount of games the psp gets in japan!

    if the ps3 had launched by itself im sure alot of the japanese devs would have been more compelled to make a global impact.


  52. Cloud Strife

    November 5, 2010 at 21:07

    with the ps3 being prohibitively expensive in 2006,im sure many devs choose to take less risk, and focus on the western markets, japan’s lack of understanding of the western market needs, have severely hampered their progress


  53. AC!D

    November 5, 2010 at 21:14

    The rest of the world is a big market and you are right they need to cater to it but not with the approach they are taking now. Not by giving Western Devs their IP’s like Devil May Cry and Dead Rising. Did Blu Castle really make a better game in Dead Rising 2 than Capcom Japan had? Did the west really make a better Bionic Commando worthy of the series? Did the Last Remnant being catered to the West and using Unreal Engine work? Did Final Fantasy really need to take inspiration from Call of Duty of all games? No!

    I think Square have the right idea about it now finally that they’ve seen FFXIII get a lukewarm reception and The Last Remnant tanking. They went out and purchased Western developers nameply Eidos and are now pumping out great IP’s like Hitman, Tomb Raider, Just Cause, Deus Ex, Kane and Lynch which are selling or will sell fantastically well in the West.

    You cant force Japanese developers to create games they dont understand how to make. They need to let them get on with creating their innovative Japanese games and then with time will come the break out AAA titles like MGS and Resi that will find popularity world wide eventually. Unortunately Capcom dont understand this but Atlus, Konami and Square are starting to learn.


  54. Aussious

    November 5, 2010 at 21:26

    Well again ASSid gets emotional and loses it. Ill say it again Conviction is by far a superior game to MGS4!Lets not start with size comparisons as MGS4 is about 5 hours of gameplay the rest is install times which everyone always seem to overlook and cutscenes which of most are pointless lil girl making eggs??? NO ASSid I can’t believe you went there and FYI go check your facts Splinter Cell lifetime sales across all platforms combined are ahead of MGS series. So whos top ten list are you actually talking about,yours? I mean the original MGS is in my top 3 list yes but MGS4 isnt even in my top 50…. Please dont tell me about review scores because proffessional opnion is still just opnion, and the difference between the two is what 5 percent which to me was all sheer nostagia on the part of the reviewers.


  55. AC!D

    November 5, 2010 at 21:37

    Id love to see those figures? Link please?


  56. Cloud Strife

    November 5, 2010 at 21:45

    Aussious lol MGS4 is like the highest rated game this gen

    and i dont think Splinter cell touches MGS Series in sales
    i read somewhere that MGS Series sales was about 30 million units, i dont think splinter cell comes anywhere near that lol!

    Splinter Cell Conviction 2.3 million sales PC&Console
    MGS IV 5 million

    Splinter cell Chaos theory 2.0 million sales
    MGS 3 5 million

    Other splinter cells 1million tops

    MGS 2 was about 7 million i think


  57. aussious

    November 7, 2010 at 11:33

    Hmm gamerankings and metacritic would beg to differ,the highest rated games this gen are as follows Super Mario Galaxy 1 & 2, GTA IV,bioshock,Orange Box, Oblivion,Red dead Redemption,Mass Effect 2,World of Goo, Morden Warfare 1&2, Little Big Planet, Uncharted 2, Gears of War, Legend of Zelda Twilight Princess, Halo 3 these are just some of the games that are all ahead of MGS4. Interms of sales the current estimate on wikipedia for Splinter Cell is over 20 Million sales against say your 30 Million MGS estimate, but of all the sites that I have checked the PC sales numbers are not tracked or accounted for (i.e.VGChartz)at all from the first game up until Conviction meaning that the figure is not accurate.So that puts SC ahead of AC and until I can get That actual figure just a bit behind MGS.


  58. AC!D

    November 7, 2010 at 12:14

    WOW you just got owned. Also he said one of the highest rated games this gen. Just for interest sake what did Conviction get on gamerankings???? 😆


  59. Nick de Bruyne

    November 7, 2010 at 13:39

    Actually he did say “Aussious lol MGS4 is like the highest rated game this gen”

    Personally, I enjoyed Convictions and its co-op stuff, but I could never say that it was as good as or better than MGS4, not with a straight face anyway.


    Sorry, I realised what I typed was wrong. I haven’t yet had the chance to play MGS4, as I missed out on the beginning of the PS3’s library, I was actually talking about Conviction when compared to the MGS series in general.


  60. aussious

    November 7, 2010 at 15:22

    Actually Conviction averaged about 85 to 86 on both Metacritic and Gamerankings, about ten or so places behind MGS4 then again Halo 3 is about 5 places ahead MGS4 and I think Halo 3 is an even more overrated game my point being professional opinion is still just opinion. But yes as a series I still prefer MGS over SC, Conviction was definitely a step in the right direction and its pitty MGS4 was Snakes last outing I think he deserved a more graceful bow and not in a graveyard learning over watching Big Boss take like 30 minutes to die trying to sum up some so called lose end going on about zero’s and one’s, ugh… Bored me to dead and this after I thought the game was over


  61. AC!D

    November 7, 2010 at 18:57

    Splinter Cell purists like myself would disagree with you. The game was way too simplified and took all the challenge and stealth out of a stealth game. Tagging and taking out 5 guys in one move is not the splinter cell way. All four Splinter cells before Conviction were better. Then again that seems to be the way these days in games. Guess how many times i died in Fable 3 in 30 hours of play? Once out of stupidity trying to get an achievement with the sword.


  62. Nick de Bruyne

    November 7, 2010 at 19:57

    You have to wonder if Ubi will split the Splinter Cell franchise in two, maybe keep the conviction and original styles separate. A nice way to maximize on the franchise and keep everyone happy I think. People will want another Splinter Cell based on the original gameplay. So why not do both?


  63. aussious

    November 8, 2010 at 07:12

    Oh now you’re a Splinter Cell purist lolz!


  64. AC!D

    November 8, 2010 at 10:29

    @Nick: Splinter Cell doesnt have a big enough fanbase to split the series Nick. I dont see why you would want it to become a action series in any case. Surely there are enough of those types of games and not enough stealth games on the market?


  65. AC!D

    November 8, 2010 at 10:36

    Yeah purist as in the way Splinter cell played in the first few games. I actually like Splinter Cell hell i even purchased both different versions of Double agent on PS2 and 360 but id rather play one single MGS game than the entire Splinter Cell franchise in total if i were forced to make that choice. I would say im a MGS purist also because i think MGS Rising should have been called something else because its not a MGS game in my eyes. It looks rather bad in comparison to a Kojima games so im waiting patiently for his next unaanounced game and wont be holding my breath for anything AAA from his younger protege.


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