Battlefield4

I played Battlefield 4 at Gamescom earlier this year and was absolutely blown away. I’ve always leant more toward Call of Duty than Battlefield but this latest one ticked all the right boxes for me and I’m really looking forward to getting it in a few weeks time. BUT

There is always a but isn’t there?

EA released a brand new Battlefield 4 trailer called Anthem and while most of it is awesome and has all the elements of a great trailer the last little bit has left me feeling uneasy.

So did anything there make you feel uncomfortable? The part that gets me is when he says

Glorious mind blowing freedom of all out war.

Now I know what he’s getting it, the scale of Battlefield allowing for all sorts of different options but war isn’t glorious. War is horrible, dirty, violent, gory and unfortunately sometimes necessary.

But it isn’t glorious, it’s not something that we should be excited about and yet it is. We play games where we kill people all the time for pure entertainment but it’s always been about saving humanity, a country, yourself or something like that. We are never the bad guys who just want war because war is fun.

Is this just me though? Am I being overly sensitive around something we all know is true even if it isn’t generally said? I’d love to know your thoughts.

Oh and will this make me not buy Battlefield 4? Not a chance, I can’t wait to enter the Battlefield but I’m not sure I’ll get it on current gen. If possible I’d rather only get into it once the PlayStation 4 arrives on our local shores.

Last Updated: October 22, 2013

1.1
was reviewed on PC

117 Comments

  1. Admiral Chief Ninja

    October 22, 2013 at 11:18

    Not just you, I feel the same.

    Has anyone ever heard the song from Rise Against, Hero of War? If not, have a listen.

    Reply

    • Umar heartless

      October 22, 2013 at 11:25

      FUCK Bro…….That song is utterly amazing and that is really what it’s like…..Innocent people are dying everyday for what?……so that fucking 12 year olds can boast about there prowess in COD?

      Reply

      • Admiral Chief Ninja

        October 22, 2013 at 11:31

        Amen

        Reply

      • NecroRince

        October 22, 2013 at 12:15

        Preach it my minion.

        Reply

    • SargonTheGreatPandaOfAkkad

      October 22, 2013 at 11:29

      Rise Against. Enough said. They have an anthem song for every possible scenario.
      Have an upvote for general classy-ness-ness, sir.

      Reply

      • Admiral Chief Ninja

        October 22, 2013 at 11:31

        Thanks dude, but I pass on the upvote to Rise Against!

        Reply

        • SargonTheGreatPandaOfAkkad

          October 22, 2013 at 11:34

          Such temperance with praise. Such.. a sir.
          Have another!

          😛

          Reply

          • Admiral Chief Ninja

            October 22, 2013 at 11:34

            Ok, this one I’ll take 😛

    • John's digital rights

      October 22, 2013 at 11:32

      Rise Against do have a few cool songs

      Reply

    • Jim Lenoir (Banana Jim)

      October 22, 2013 at 12:38

      Awesome song

      Reply

    • Skyblue

      October 22, 2013 at 12:54

      MOAR old school for me. Pantera FTW!

      Reply

  2. oVg

    October 22, 2013 at 11:27

    All these hybrid games. Are the ports being up scaled or down scaled?

    Reply

  3. Umar heartless

    October 22, 2013 at 11:28

    Gav you are not alone. I get it’s a game, but I’m sick of this glorification of war. This world is in turmoil and people…Women and children are dying for the sake of what?….Soldiers are sent to the frontline for the greed of our leaders. Men give their lives for honor, for their country, but do they need protection from ‘terrorists’? Or from the very people the serve. These games make it seem all glamorous and it’s diluting the effect of the word…war

    Reply

    • SargonTheGreatPandaOfAkkad

      October 22, 2013 at 11:32

      It started with the edification of the glories of the Ancients in war (Sargon of Akkad, Ramses II, Alexander, take your pick). It’s not about to leave anytime soon. We are no more enlightened now than we were in the agora circa 600 B.C.E. We’re still painting cave walls with our glorious endeavours. How amazing are we.

      Headshot!

      Reply

      • Umar heartless

        October 22, 2013 at 11:39

        Let it be known throughout the ages, that man stood at the pinnacle of war. We fought valiantly for our country and our people….That’s what they tell soldiers right? That you are protecting your people and country. What our wall paintings fail to depict are the innocent lives lost in the war…there is not enough room for those people on the wall..no…glory be to those that fought in the war and those that started it!

        Reply

        • SargonTheGreatPandaOfAkkad

          October 22, 2013 at 11:52

          There is always room for those people on the wall! They’re usually the slaves. 😛

          Reply

    • Matthew Holliday

      October 22, 2013 at 11:44

      how to make games fun without war?
      Play more sims and racing games?

      Reply

      • Umar heartless

        October 22, 2013 at 11:45

        Make games like Spec Ops that show the true horror of war.Even then, there are too many war games

        Reply

    • Sageville

      October 22, 2013 at 11:48

      Men are aggressive beings, we have violence in our genes. Our society makes us tuck that stuff away under the guise of normality. I enjoy war/fighting games as a release or action on my inherent nature. My own conscience prevents me from acting on such urges IRL.

      The problem is those politicians/generals that actually play war for real.

      Reply

      • Umar heartless

        October 22, 2013 at 11:54

        Yup fighting the war for the greedy…how sad this world we live in

        Reply

        • Circuitflow

          October 22, 2013 at 12:03

          oh so u will enjoy playing where there is no violence, just cupcakes, rainbow and ponies!!!

          Reply

          • Umar heartless

            October 22, 2013 at 12:05

            So you are implying a game without violence is just fluffy?……Also Who said anything about violence?

          • Circuitflow

            October 22, 2013 at 12:16

            LOL War is Violence is it not?

          • Umar heartless

            October 22, 2013 at 12:27

            A game without war can still be violent. I’m just talking about the concept of war itself

          • Circuitflow

            October 22, 2013 at 12:32

            i fail to understa…… CUPCAKES! i really want CupcAkes now. !
            is there not another medium u can use to express your opinion about the conceopt of war. Is this not a gaming site to talk about GAMES ..why oh why do u want to bring real life issues into this?

          • Circuitflow

            October 22, 2013 at 12:23

            dammit now i want cupcakes!!

    • FSR

      October 22, 2013 at 11:58

      No one is forcing you to play these games. Be an adult. Make a mature, responsible choice based on your own morals and frame of reference. Clearly you cannot distinguish between reality and the glorious virtual world we have access to.

      Reply

      • Umar heartless

        October 22, 2013 at 12:01

        I am not talking about myself. I’m just generally talking about these games that glorify war. No need to get insulting bro.

        Reply

        • FSR

          October 22, 2013 at 13:32

          Apologies for the personal attack, that was not my intention. You make valid and grounded point good sir.

          Reply

      • Admiral Chief Ninja

        October 22, 2013 at 12:02

        No need to get all personal FSR

        Reply

        • NecroRince

          October 22, 2013 at 12:20

          Agreed.

          Reply

      • Sageville

        October 22, 2013 at 12:14

        Yeah, legit Downvote for personal attack.

        Reply

        • NecroRince

          October 22, 2013 at 12:17

          With you on that. Only noobs go for that.

          Reply

      • NecroRince

        October 22, 2013 at 12:18

        You have no idea what he can/cannot distinguish between. If you are unable to understand an opinion, rather shut up than get personal, least we all fall down that hole.

        Reply

  4. Admiral Chief Ninja

    October 22, 2013 at 11:32

    Has anyone here ever played SpecOps: The Line? Do yourself a favour, jam that, after ‘that’ scene and after the whole game, you will think twice about the glories of war

    Reply

    • John's digital rights

      October 22, 2013 at 11:35

      Liked the scenes, not so much the game.

      Reply

      • Admiral Chief Ninja

        October 22, 2013 at 11:36

        Gameplay was rather generic and meh, but the story! Oh sweet merciful gouda cheese, that story was brilliant!

        Reply

        • Gavin Mannion

          October 22, 2013 at 11:37

          One of the best games of this generation… pity the gampeplay was boring 🙂

          Reply

          • Admiral Chief Ninja

            October 22, 2013 at 11:38

            Agreed. BUT, thinking back, I remember not the boring gameplay, but the way the game made me feel, and think

            Also, its gameplay, not gampeplay 😛

          • Gavin Mannion

            October 22, 2013 at 11:39

            IT IS WHAT I SAY IT IS….

            Yeah the story from Spec Ops is amazing.. I heartily recommend everyone play that game

          • Admiral Chief Ninja

            October 22, 2013 at 11:41

            That story grabbed me, one of the best in a game I dare even say

        • John's digital rights

          October 22, 2013 at 11:40

          I agree. Great story, but (IMHO) the gameplay ruined it a bit for me.

          Reply

    • Alien Emperor Trevor

      October 22, 2013 at 11:39

      That story is pretty epic.

      Reply

    • Sageville

      October 22, 2013 at 12:15

      I downloaded that from PS+.

      Is it worth playing, looks a bit dated tech-wise.

      Reply

      • Admiral Chief Ninja

        October 22, 2013 at 12:15

        Very much worth it. Gameplay is very meh, but the story makes up for in in spades!

        Reply

    • SauRoN

      October 22, 2013 at 12:59

      I finished it last night.

      Excellent game, but I had to worry what the entire fuss was about with “that scene”.

      It’s hardly that dramatic and could have been implemented much more emotionally if they wanted to.

      I’ve been much more “moved” by the likes of Beyond or the Last of Us recently or the Metal Gear Solids of old if you want a true war theme comparison.

      Reply

    • Skyblue

      October 22, 2013 at 13:01

      Worth playing? I have it on PS3 (PS+) and played the first level, found the controls to be horrendous but I found out it’s available on PC as well so I’d rather do that if it’s any good.

      Reply

      • Admiral Chief Ninja

        October 22, 2013 at 13:03

        Very much yes! (as to the worth playing) In terms of controls, the snap to cover mechanic on PC seems very buggy/console-ified (yes, thats a word), but the story really makes up for it.

        Reply

        • Skyblue

          October 22, 2013 at 13:08

          Cool, I’ll be picking it up then, thx.

          Reply

  5. Circuitflow

    October 22, 2013 at 11:33

    Gavin ur a little overly sensitive, IT’s just a game and BF4 WAR IS GLORIOUS. Is this site not about games and noting esle??? i do see actual war stories being posted here.. anf if they start u wont see me comiung back here

    Reply

  6. Alien Emperor Trevor

    October 22, 2013 at 11:38

    War… war never changes.

    Reply

    • John's digital rights

      October 22, 2013 at 11:41

      That’s from Fallout.

      Fallout ftw.

      Reply

  7. Admiral Chief Ninja

    October 22, 2013 at 11:39

    I’m guessing the downvote troll approves of the glorification of war

    Reply

    • John's digital rights

      October 22, 2013 at 11:42

      I was checking all the comments where it downvotes. Some of them contradict one another. So who knows what it’s thinking.

      Reply

      • Admiral Chief Ninja

        October 22, 2013 at 11:43

        Unable to think I’d say, just general bile, as if to prove some silly point

        Reply

        • John's digital rights

          October 22, 2013 at 11:45

          Take my upvote (possibly soon to be balanced out by a downvote)

          Reply

        • Alien Emperor Trevor

          October 22, 2013 at 11:48

          “Oh look, they said something I didn’t like, now I’ll destroy their self-esteem. Fear me & my all-powerful voting ability!”

          Reply

          • John's digital rights

            October 22, 2013 at 11:49

            I’m shivering right now just thinking about that.

          • ToshZA

            October 22, 2013 at 13:02

            Too funny. Have an upvote. 😀

  8. hendrik

    October 22, 2013 at 11:40

    No way, it is just you. Have you never played as the Soviets in Red Alert? Or Yuri in the sequels? What about GTA? you’re never the good guy

    Reply

    • Gavin Mannion

      October 22, 2013 at 11:41

      I’m the good guy in GTA.. I give hte ladies money back whenever she gets mugged… after killing the mugger 🙂

      There are a lot of games where you can be the bad guy (the arabs in Black ops 2 MP etc) but the main theme of the games is always save the world type thing…

      Reply

    • hendrik

      October 22, 2013 at 11:42

      I quote Radik Gradenko in the first briefing: “Kill everything and everyone, no prisoners, no survivors……that is all”

      Reply

  9. FSR

    October 22, 2013 at 11:43

    Oh come now. Gaming war and real war are so very different. I love playing war games… i would never fight in a real war. If you’re not mature enough to make that distinction there is little hope for you.

    Reply

    • Admiral Chief Ninja

      October 22, 2013 at 11:44

      Indeed, but the tone of the trailer draws no distinction

      Reply

      • Circuitflow

        October 22, 2013 at 11:45

        yes it does! the distiction is that is about a game! DUH! U can take what is said in the gaming context and applied it to real life.context!!..

        Reply

        • Admiral Chief Ninja

          October 22, 2013 at 11:46

          Still, there is nothing glorious in war

          Reply

          • Circuitflow

            October 22, 2013 at 11:50

            real war yes , nothing glorious.. but in BF oh boy is it GLORIOUS!!!
            Seriously why go there, why do we compare games to real life??? is it not the reason we play games is to get away from the strict grip of real life ??? If we are going to look at games and real life as the same thing then why do we get so upset if violet games are blammed for violet outlet in real life? Coz we know there is a clear distiction, ( not to mention bad parenting )

          • Admiral Chief Ninja

            October 22, 2013 at 11:53

            We all know how easily children and people are influenced, the muppets and sheep out there take every little thing so literally, so in fact they are influenced to think that way.

            In any case, yes, the gameplay in BF4 looks glorious, I agree. Just the way they portrayed it, was maybe a bit too much

          • Circuitflow

            October 22, 2013 at 11:57

            i get ya man, but i think u and Gavin both are a little too Sensitive today w.r.t to this. I get the complete diffrent feel, i get goose bumbs at the end of the vid where loads loads are standing on the boat.. “we’ll see u there” damn straight you will. makes me feel that your are a part of something …….. wait for it………………… wait for it….. GLORIOUS!

          • Admiral Chief Ninja

            October 22, 2013 at 12:00

            Yeah, the vid and gameplay is awesome, but just take a read on this again:

            “Glorious mind blowing freedom of all out war”

            And the way its portrayed, that’s what is wrong with the world man

          • Circuitflow

            October 22, 2013 at 12:06

            lets go smoke some good shit then u can tell me all about what is wrong with this world.. But none the less i get /respect what ya saying. That saying is exactly what Battlefield 4 is all about, glorious ( Awesome gameplay) Mind blowing( next gen graphics) freedom( Choice within the game) all out war( what BF is!) why read more into it then what it is?

          • Admiral Chief Ninja

            October 22, 2013 at 12:08

            Cool man. Not everyone can differentiate between real/virtual and will be easily influenced adversely.

          • Circuitflow

            October 22, 2013 at 12:12

            true that, but that’s where maturity come into play, If u cant diffetentiate between the two then dont play those games.

            There are age restiction for a reason for those young ones that are still unable to tell real and virtual apart.

            What wrong with this word u say: Bad parenting for one.

          • Admiral Chief Ninja

            October 22, 2013 at 12:15

            No argument there, you can even change “bad parenting” phrase to “no parenting”

            Young minds are very impressionable

          • FSR

            October 22, 2013 at 11:51

            Again… real live versus pixels! I can be a GLORIOUS bank robber, or even a viking, or a medieval knight… in a virtual world. That doesn’t mean i am inclined to in real life.

          • Admiral Chief Ninja

            October 22, 2013 at 11:56

            Indeed, but the real life flesh and blood person, depicting and advocating “glorious war”, even though in pixels as you keep putting it, will influence the wrong people the wrong way.

            I’m not saying the game is not glorious, so maybe just climb off the fanboi seat for a second and think for a minute.

            In any case, I put forth the way I feel, you can feel what you like

          • Circuitflow

            October 22, 2013 at 11:59

            i would incluide tyo agree with if he was dressed in all out war gear, but no he is dress in normal clothes as to say he will be playing it from his coach.like we all will.

          • Admiral Chief Ninja

            October 22, 2013 at 12:01

            …or that he is merely casual to the fact.

            But in any case, let it be for you, as you feel/believe, and for me, as I feel/believe. The fact that you and @disqus_729vEDOyF6:disqus are in full battle mode, is just not helping your case along.

            Moving on

          • Circuitflow

            October 22, 2013 at 12:19

            LOL” to each it’s own!”

      • FSR

        October 22, 2013 at 11:48

        but the trailer is for a VIDEO GAME!!!!! it makes that very clear, you know, the part where its a “Battlefield 4” trailer. Just because i can headshot pixels with a sniper rifle doesn’t mean i a. have the ability to do that in real life, or b. the need to.

        Reply

      • Sageville

        October 22, 2013 at 14:00

        So you couldn’t tell that it was a game?

        Reply

        • SargonTheGreatPandaOfAkkad

          October 22, 2013 at 14:09

          If I was Basarwa, probably not.

          Reply

    • SargonTheGreatPandaOfAkkad

      October 22, 2013 at 12:37

      Well why stop there? We should get rid of the pesky “moral” line altogether. Why not throw in a little bit of rape into our genocide? Pixel rape is fine, right? We can also do some ethnic cleansing. I mean.. as long as they’re pixels, yeah? I also really do enjoy a little terrorism. I really don’t mind blowing up a school full of pixel children every now and again. While we’re at it.. gaming might as well incorporate some underage sex slavery into its folds. Nothing sells like hassle-free pixel (thus not real and has no moral implication on anything anywhere) fun.

      I mean. I’m mature. I can make the distinction. Just eradicate the line altogether. Anything goes, as long as it’s pixel!

      Are you serious? Of course there is a reason that a lot of these topics are carefully covered and that age restrictions ought to be applied rigorously. Not everyone IS mature. Nor do all adults possess the mental faculties to tell the difference between real and pixellated carnage. YOU may be able to. And you’re well within your rights to feel this way. But you cannot just write off the real ramifications that these games DO have. Or what they DO say about our society. You don’t have to be an anthropologist, sociologist, or psychologist to find this theme of colosoul import. Yet there is rigorous study being undertaken on/around/within gaming. Do you think that that is just for fun?

      Pierre Bourdieu could work wonders with symbolic capital. You don’t get to ignore all of that just because you can tell the difference (assumed rather than shown) between “real life” and “pixels”. There are processes of sublimation you’re not even aware of that work below (and above) the level of the individual. It is gross ignorance to write that off so casually. As all things, symbolic capital too can change. Perhaps it ought to – if we hold the sakes of killers higher than those of Medecins Sans Frontieres?

      Reply

      • FSR

        October 22, 2013 at 12:51

        You clearly missed my point that context is everything. THE CONTEXT HERE IS BATTLEFIELD 4. End of story. So all your other extrapolation is moot.

        In the CONTEXT of the trailer does it glorify real war? Or does it glorify virtual war? That was my point.

        Reply

        • SargonTheGreatPandaOfAkkad

          October 22, 2013 at 14:05

          I didn’t miss your point. You said: “Context is EVERYTHING here.”
          It was very postmodern. I almost shed a tear. 😉

          In all seriousness – of course context is everything. The video is an attempt to sell the game with some raw in game footage. We can expect that the game will look like that. It’ll be a festival of war. But pixels are a symbol of reality (how else could they come to be if not). It is a representation (or fantasy) of reality.

          You, as the discerning and intelligent Homo sapiens, can easily divorce yourself of any notion that those images are real. So can I. So can (I hope) the majority of people reading this. But what if you couldn’t…?

          What if those images weren’t perceived the way that they were intended?

          It’s not like that ever happens right? It’s not like a cross could be perceived for something other than the forgiveness, hope, and love, that it’s adherents hope it represents? Oh wait.. people are different? Cultural paradigms shift? They’re not static? Structuralism isn’t really all that? Oh dear. It seems context is everything. Context of the watcher, doing the watching. Not just one individual.

          Reply

          • FSR

            October 22, 2013 at 14:16

            As soon as you say “But what if you couldn’t” you stray from the point i keep trying to re-inforce. You are arguing (and granted, with a well substantiated and well thought out point of view, with the vocabulary to match) a series of “what if’s”. It’s like me saying that Julius Malema is wrong for wanting to nationalise the mining industry… but what if he’s not wrong? Where does that leave my argument? With no traction or grounds for factual discussion. It spirals into a philosophical debate that will yield no victor.

            The fact that the title of the video says “Battlefield 4” and has the text “actual in-game footage” solidifies the context. The only debate from there is “what if people can’t read?” then their context would be different. But we are all communicating in english here, so one can make the assumption that those of us who watched the trailer here, will most likely, understand the context.

            I think you’re reading far more into my opinion that is necessary.

          • SargonTheGreatPandaOfAkkad

            October 22, 2013 at 14:30

            The “what if” paradigm is to get you to think about the others in this story. That is all. If you can get there, you’d see as I see. I by no means think I’m right (well – not as much as Julius thinks that he is correct).

            You want traction? Grounds for factual discussions? Children play these games. They watch this footage (as well as films etc that they really really shouldn’t). They cannot be held to the same cognitive standards as fully mature adults. They just can’t. So the ability that you and I have to steer past the symbolic capture of reality (in so far as we’re able to understand this new reality) children are not always capable of. Now we’re also aware that a small proportion of the functional adult population in nations around the world suffer from a variety of mental and other issues (insert here syndromes, disorders, etc) and you suddenly have a very real (and undoubtable) group of people who do not perceive the world as you do.

            Now what?

            We too easily shrug off the ramifications of creating these types of games. I’m not a news anchor. I don’t think “games kill people”. But I know that people (often with disorders, syndromes, etc) kill people for a variety of reasons (not all of which are sane, reasonable, etc). And access to mediums of pixel carnage, for these people not of our cultural/societal persuasion, may lead to considerable damage. Because we’re not all on the same page in the ideological universe. A lot of us believe a lot of crazy who ha.

            It’s not that I’m reading into it too much. But there is a debate here. And it needs to be had. We have to be responsible for the shit we put out there. Yeah – it’s fun. Yeah – it’s most often relatively harmless. Yeah – the wrong political groups hype it up to death so it seems it’s evil when it really isn’t. But it most certainly IS guilty of glorifying (even symbolically) something that needs consideration. There are lines. We draw those lines in different places. And some of us only learn to draw them from the society we have access to.

            Anyway. I’m not targeting you. I enjoy a good debate. 🙂

          • FSR

            October 22, 2013 at 14:43

            I’m in no way taking it personally, I can see you like a good debate. 🙂

            I get what you’re saying. But the scale of this particular debate stretches far further and deeper than a game trailer. It asks questions about society as a whole. I get that.

            That said, I stand by my opinion that no, this particular trailer, on this gaming site, does not glorify war, but glorifies virtual war. Nothing more, nothing less.

          • SargonTheGreatPandaOfAkkad

            October 22, 2013 at 15:16

            Fair enough. I agree with you. The trailer glorifies the war you can experience in the game. It’s clearly a gameplay video to me. I am taking that sentence and running with it to touch on broader issues.

            If that isn’t something we care to chat about, it’s all good. I understand you were just making a comment about the trailer. I just feel that it’s a chat worth having. Gamers should have it. Developers should have it. Maybe if we do have the chat.. it’ll stop silly reporters turning every horrific tragic murder spree in the US a discourse about how gaming is evil. Because we would have already taken a long hard look at ourselves, ya know?

          • FSR

            October 22, 2013 at 15:30

            I hear ya.

      • Sageville

        October 22, 2013 at 13:28

        Why do you even play games at all?

        if your impression of gaming is one of a direct (or subliminal) driver of your personality without your own moral steering then surely you should avoid all that direct influence that you are incapable of differentiating from reality.

        I don’t want to play a rape game cause it does not appeal to me (though I sure it would appeal to some “people”), war games do appeal to me, because it peaks my primal violent nature and my moral compass can safely identify that artificial stimulus as being artificial.

        It is highly assumptive to think most humans are unable to discern the difference.

        I’ll leave this with you:

        War and violence existed long before video games and movies started to depict war and violence. Why know do people want to force this linkage to explain the current human condition? Why? Because it’s convenient.

        Reply

        • SargonTheGreatPandaOfAkkad

          October 22, 2013 at 14:01

          A) This isn’t about me. I’m only speaking to variability within society and the impact that violence can have on minds which cannot readily tell the difference between reality and video games.

          B) It’s assumptive to think most humans are unable to discern the difference? Are you for real? How many children and young adults have access to these games? How many people who have psychological problems have access to games? Not because people may give it to them. But perhaps because no one cares? I’ve seen eight year olds play GTA titles. What was the age restriction again…?

          C) I am not talking about you. I don’t care about the individual. I’m interested in the broader societal ramifications and the inherent human variability that people seem to happy to ignore.

          D) I love video games. I play them because they’re fun. I am not damning video games. Just like I don’t damn porn. But you need to be responsible and realise that these things DO impact people (maybe not you – maybe not me – but how the heck can you be so sure they don’t influence Joanesq). They’re capable of being powerful symbols. Just like everything else can be if you’re not sensitive to it.

          E) According to your position – just remove all boundaries? Okay. Go for it. Let them make the games that some people (not you) may want to play. Then let it somehow fall into the hands of a naive, impressionable, young child. See how that turns out.

          (P.S. I broke this up because I could only really reply in point form. I’m sorry if this seems aggressive. Long day. Just trying to point out I’m not anti-gaming obviously. But only that we need to be aware that violent gaming may not cause violent directly – but they remain symbols of something we haven’t really worked out yet)

          Reply

          • Sageville

            October 22, 2013 at 14:50

            Ugh, point form…

            Firstly, unsupervised children and mentally challenged people should not be exposed to the adult content we are discussing, Yes they are impressionable, but they shouldn’t be playing violent games imo anyways. So I’m taking them out of this debate. I still stand firm that most people *(exculding above) CAN differentiate between real and virtual/game, so I’m tossing that out of the discussion too.

            Secondly, I get the social ramifications etc angle and such, but that’s open to wide debate as there are so many variables to consider that that discussion is intractable and very hard to prove.

            There’s a saying I just made up “If you look hard and long enough for something, you will find it, whether it’s actually there or not”. Meaning for example, if we continually tell people Weed is dangerous like we did in the 50’s (Reefer madness) people will believe that to be true. I draw parallel to the Violent Video Games = Violence IRL debate. In the end if we are continually over-sensitized (as the current society tells us we should) to everything (real or imagined) we will start endoctrining ourselves.

            But, who cares, I play what I want, my games don’t play me.

          • SargonTheGreatPandaOfAkkad

            October 22, 2013 at 15:14

            Don’t be slamming point form, yo. Sometimes a debate needs to be broken down so we don’t get crazy off topic.

            In any respect. You can remove children and the mentally handicapped. But it doesn’t change that there are still people who don’t fall in those categories who easily suffer from a variety of undiagnosed issues which may make it difficult for them to divorce reality from pixels (or may use symbolism in such a way as was not intended – which is really my main point). Picking up a DSM (if one trusts a board of psychologists out to make money) reveals only a fraction of western traditional ailments.

            In addition, once you start extended beyond our cultural bias, we may encounter further problems. Here we need only pick up sociology of popular culture for support for analysis within our own cultural package (or just Marx, Lacan, Derrida, etc). Or a variety of other disciples for moving beyond our own ‘boundaries’.

            I’m NOT saying violent video games lead to violence. This isn’t an oversimplification of crime in the real world. I have never once stated (nor will I ever state) that violence in video games leads to violence in real life. This isn’t the 50’s. Our social scientists know better than that.
            This is about symbols (see commodities etc) being used in unintended ways, especially when they are easily accessible. People, unhinged or unfamiliar with these symbols for whatever reason, can co opt or misinterpret the virtual violence for real violence. People kill people, not games. But games (like movies, music, etc) need to be responsible. They ARE symbols. They ARE popular. That is all I’m getting at. Not everyone is mature and sentient as you are. Not everyone plays their games. Sometimes, people aren’t in control of what we consider to be “normal” senses. Sometimes people sucks. You need only see some of the language used on these servers to see that something happens. Maybe it’s just the competition. But I don’t see Suarez doing that every match. And he is one of the more volatile..

          • Sageville

            October 22, 2013 at 15:31

            We’ll have to agree to disagree on the amount of people able to discern Reality vs Virtuality, especially when undiagnosed issues comes in the mix. Personally I don’t know anyone who can’t tell the difference.

            Admittedly, you may be above my education levels wrt. some of your points (Lacan, Derrida etc), my bad.

            Also I may have over-extended the Violence linkages as you stated, and I do agree with you that there should be responsibility in how such content should be made available. But I do think that is already in place in the forms of age restrictions, if those age restrictions are ignored then sure, expect drama and problems.

            My point again, we humans are made of sterner stuff than I feel you suggest, I hope so at least. If we keep a nanny state like approach and are afraid at every possible influence out in the world we will fall victim to our own suggestions.

            Somewhere, somehow, someway, we have strayed far from the topic…..

  10. Matthew Holliday

    October 22, 2013 at 11:45

    Haha
    Gavin thinking Battlefield should be played on anything other than a PC
    Hilarious

    Reply

    • Admiral Chief Ninja

      October 22, 2013 at 11:46

      XD

      Reply

  11. SauRoN

    October 22, 2013 at 11:59

    Yes, you are being overly sensitive in an effort to generate content.

    Reply

    • Admiral Chief Ninja

      October 22, 2013 at 12:06

      So he is not allowed an opinion?

      Reply

      • SauRoN

        October 22, 2013 at 12:10

        Of course he is, nobody said he isn’t allowed to post it.

        But it seems like nothing more than contrarian bullshit just for the sake of being different.

        Reply

        • Admiral Chief Ninja

          October 22, 2013 at 12:14

          Well, if you knew Gav, then you’d realise its not “just for the sake of being different”

          As he mentioned above, the content is already there, he merely input his opinion on it

          Reply

          • ToshZA

            October 22, 2013 at 13:01

            It’s a valid opinion too, and I’m sure there are many people who share that opinion. Granted, they’re mostly ‘Mericans, but still.

    • Gavin Mannion

      October 22, 2013 at 12:09

      Content would have been here anyway.. it’s a new trailer for a top rated game..

      Reply

      • SauRoN

        October 22, 2013 at 13:01

        Fair point.

        I just see this recent internet phenomenon of guys trying to “out sensitive” each other and it makes me want to puke.

        Sure let’s not all run off to war while shitting rainbows, but on the flipside let’s not start crying when a bunny steps on a thorn either.

        Reply

        • Sageville

          October 22, 2013 at 13:39

          guys trying to “out sensitive” each other

          LoL, so true, upvote for you there sir.

          Reply

        • Gavin Mannion

          October 22, 2013 at 14:29

          I agree with that, I hate the fact that some random fart can state that he’s offended and now the world is expected to change.. That’s not what I’m gonig for at all here.

          I’m just sharing that it made me feel uncomfortable, I don’t think anyone else has said anything like that so I’m definitely not jumping on a bandwagon.

          Reply

  12. Ir0nseraph

    October 22, 2013 at 12:09

    It’s a game and should be taken in that context , and I will also be waiting for my ps4 version.

    Reply

  13. NecroRince

    October 22, 2013 at 12:14

    War glorious war! Merica!

    Reply

  14. Sir Rants-a-Lot Llew

    October 22, 2013 at 12:16

    Well, I’m in two minds on this.

    1) It’s just a game.
    2) They need to stop glorifying war as it isn’t glorius as you said.

    I actually have nothing constructive or critical to say here since I can’t decide which side of the fence I am on so I will read the comments and see what others say.

    Not sure why I had to post that instead of just thinking it in my head. Am I a commentor addict?

    Reply

  15. Sageville

    October 22, 2013 at 12:30

    I’m sorry, but if people can’t divorce the concept of “Actual” vs “Virtual”, then they should definitely not play video games. I would only be insensed if the comment “Glorious mind blowing freedom of all out war” was made by a dictator or president in Real Life.

    Real War isn’t glorious, war games or movies can be, people love the idea of war, but hate the actual reality of it. That’s just life, if we remove the escapism of our entertainment by making direct causal links to reality then we are in serious shite.

    Reply

    • Circuitflow

      October 22, 2013 at 12:34

      Thats what i been saying! UPVOTE x 1 mil for u!

      Reply

  16. ToshZA

    October 22, 2013 at 12:47

    To be honest, the Glorious part doesn’t bother me one bit. He’s not referring to real war, but rather in-game war. In-game war, IS glorious. It IS fun, and taking out an entire squad with just your pistol and a shit ton of luck is the most glorious thing imaginable. But it’s fantasy. It’s not real war. The dead respawn in 10 seconds, and you get to kill them all over again.

    Real war is horrific. Battlefield is not advocating that one bit.

    Reply

  17. Maxiviper117

    October 22, 2013 at 12:48

    I just think that FPS games are the best games at bringing out our inner competitiveness more than any other games, that’s why this genre does so well. Killing a virtual character being played by a real person seems more satisfying, not satisfying in the way that you “killed’ them but rather its satisfying because for that moment you “Beat” them in a personal way by killing their virtual character. You just dont get the same feeling beating a person playing need for speed.

    Its not like because we kill thousands of people in games we think war and killing people in real life is glorious in any way WHAT SO EVER!!. It never is.

    Reply

  18. loftie

    October 22, 2013 at 13:49

    nah, over sensitive, just a game.

    Reply

  19. MacDoodle

    October 22, 2013 at 14:07

    If you were an unfortunate soul who had survived war and seen it in all its ugliness I should think that playing these kinds of games would be anything but glorious and would be the last form of entertainment such a person would indulge

    Reply

    • Sageville

      October 22, 2013 at 15:40

      I’m sure I read somewhere that COD is the most played game on Xbox in the troop entertainment centers for deployed USA military in Iraq.

      Could just be the Murica factor though…

      Reply

      • MacDoodle

        October 22, 2013 at 16:02

        Yeah that is more than likely true, not all those folks jamming are combatants so a good chance they not so exposed to the horrors of war

        Reply

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